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Lack of teachers 'to hit plans to cut class sizes'

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Published Date: 02 September 2007
MINISTERS were under fire last night over their high-profile plans to cut primary class sizes, as new figures showed there will be only a small increase in the number of teachers available from next year.
Education Secretary Fiona Hyslop told Parliament earlier this summer that an extra 250 teacher-training places would be made available. She has pledged to reduce P1, P2 and P3 classes to no more than 18.

The extra places have been secured in teac
her-training colleges, as promised, but it has emerged this has only balanced out a cut in the number of total places.

Education chiefs decided in January that the number of teaching-training posts should be reduced by 205. Consequently, the extra 250 posts announced by the SNP means the actual number of places is only up by 45, from 1,476 to 1,521.

A spokeswoman for Hyslop said that the small increase would still ensure class sizes were soon reduced. But Labour education spokesman Hugh Henry, the former education minister, claimed: "These kinds of numbers will in no way deliver what they want to do. I know people who voted for them because of this pledge and it is a disgrace that they won't be able to deliver on that."

However, Hyslop's spokeswoman replied: "We have got falling school rolls. We have looked ahead, as always happens every year, and then given guidance on the numbers of places that will be required. We don't want to churn teachers out for the dole."

The extra places refer only to postgraduate training posts, where students train for one year following a degree.

In the SNP government document last week setting out their first 100 days in power, it insisted: "We will ensure that teacher numbers in the teaching training colleges in the autumn of 2007 are at a level to start driving down class sizes in P1-P3. Ministers will identify which schools can move to class sizes of 18 from 2008, with our full commitment rolled out thereafter".



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  • Last Updated: 01 September 2007 6:53 PM
  • Source: Scotland On Sunday
  • Location: Scotland
  • Related Topics: Teaching
 
1

The Monk,

01/09/2007 23:38:41

What about all the teachers from schools that they are closing?

2

Guga II,

Rockall 02/09/2007 01:36:35

Typical Hootsmon. Get the boot into the SNP government for all the failings of their buddies in the New Labour numpty party. The SNP will need a bit of time to sort out the mess left behind by the numpties.

3

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 02/09/2007 05:52:08

Neither Andre Ampère nor James Clerk Maxwell attended primary school yet became the key players towards our understanding of electromagnetics and all subsequent developments. So primary school seems more a "baby siting" service than education. Like animals, children like routine, but is it a good one in scottish schools?

4

avrom,

edinburgh 02/09/2007 06:38:48

If the executive had kept its nose out of the way children are taught, done away with useless targets and allowed the teachers to teach instead of spending half the year revising for a 5-14 test, then teachers would not have trouble teaching basic literacy and numeracy to a class of pupils.

5

juststarted,

scotland 02/09/2007 07:34:32

Is this the Hugh Henry who pledged to cut class sizes in S1 and 2 maths classes and then backed down?

He lost the right to critices anyone on class sizes a year ago. Instead of everybody getting the chance of being in a smaller class he gave it up and classes could be manipulated so there was only an average of 20.

So much for Hugh's commitment to equal opportunities.

6

Stephen101,

Who cares what Hugh says? 02/09/2007 08:10:03

Hugh Who??

7

Gordon,

Edinburgh 02/09/2007 08:13:19

How will this work in Edinburgh??

They're busy reducing the number of classrooms available, so will be "overcrowded" by the time the legislation is passed.

8

Bridged,

and tunnelled 02/09/2007 09:52:40

hasn't Eddie Barnes totally misunderstood this?

If before the election we needed 1000 or 1200 teachers in 2008, we would only train the number needed to get them.

So if we are actually training more than 1500, that means there is an increase of several hundred, and since the SNP promised 250, this could well mean they are bang on target.

9

Bridged,

and tunnelled 02/09/2007 10:04:15

I went rootling a bit more.

See http://www.sfc.ac.uk/information/info_circulars/sfc/2007/...

This shows that the expected number of students was 1255.

If 1255 students were sufficient before the election, and there are 1520 now, that means the 250 the SNP promised have been delivered and can start cutting class sizes in 2008 when they qualify.

So this is a bit of a non story.

10

Zibi,

Drummond Community High School 02/09/2007 11:40:07

Anyone wishing to petition the Scottish parliament to stop the school closures in Edinburgh can do so at this link;

http://epetitions.scottish.parliament.uk/view_petition.as...

11

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 02/09/2007 13:16:18

What shortage of teachers would that be ?

It's only a few weeks since this paper (and others) were carrying articles about the 90% or so of newly qualified teachers who haven't managed to get jobs this year. Not only that but there are a lot of teachers in training over the next two years in excess of the numbers normally required (to cope with the coming exodus of retiring teachers).

If they don't get jobs quickly then they'll clear off and takes jobs anywhere but teaching !

Get emailing your MSPs about this problem otherwise a shed-load of money will have been wasted on training teachers who don't teach.

13

Rev,

Fife 02/09/2007 21:50:52

FAlling school rolls! If only - our local primary school, opened in 1997 cannot accommodate all the children in catchment - every address in the catchment has dual catchment (ie an alternative school if there are no places in ours.) Siblings are not even guaranteed a place. Single stream school should have had a few extra classrooms to accommodate bulge years - but what can you expect from politicians.

14

Kitti Kat,

02/09/2007 22:23:41

I still don't quite understand the Scottish way of educating kids. Where I live, the counties are in charge of their schools and what goes on. The government has no real say , leaving it to the idividual school districts. Most do very well by the students. Yes, some, like Philadelphia, Chester, and one or two others could improve but in the suburban counties, we have great schools, run by a local school board, not the politicians. Can the parents and taxpayers over there cause enough pressure to change things for the better?

15

Flash67,

Edinburgh 03/09/2007 09:22:06

#13 - agreed. The easy part for the Executive is funding a few hundred places in training college. The more expensive part is providing councils with extra funding to employ more teachers on a permanent basis. Right now, because of the 'guaranteed probation year' scheme, many schools are using these recent graduates as cheap teachers, and replacing them on a yearly basis. Result? Pupils having year after year of changing, inexperienced teachers and many disgruntled, recently qualified teachers heading back to their previous years. Councils, HTs, and the Scottish Govt. need to get heads together on this problem, as who would want to do all this training then get chucked on the scrapheap after a year?


 

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