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Neighbours told to shop drunks and drug addicts



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Published Date: 06 January 2008
SCOTS are being urged to shop their neighbours to police and social workers if they suspect they are neglecting their children because of drug addiction or alcohol abuse.


In a major new campaign to be launched next month, the Scottish Government will call on residents to expose any addicts or alcoholics in their area who are failing to care for their children.

They want people to use a new dedicated national ph
oneline, linked to the authorities, who may then visit the affected families and take their children away if they are deemed to be in danger.

Ministers denied last night that the plan would become a "snooper's charter", insisting that, such is the scale of the crisis affecting vulnerable families, drastic measures are now necessary.

The latest figures show that there are as many as 60,000 Scottish children who currently live with drug abusers. A further 100,000 are believed to be living with parents with an alcohol problem.

In one tragic case, two-year-old Derek Doran died at his home in East Lothian after drinking the heroin substitute methadone, which had been prescribed for his parents.

Politicians from all parties have warned they are being inundated with information about shocking cases of babies and children being left unwashed and unfed by parents who care only about their next fix or another drink.

In a bid to emphasise the scale of the problem, ministers want to brand the new phoneline "the fourth emergency number", alongside police, fire and ambulance services.

Calls are to be taken by a central unit and treated confidentially. If necessary, incidents could then be referred on to police or social workers.

Ministers hope the phoneline could become as well-used as the Crimestoppers line.

Minister for Community Safety Fergus Ewing told Scotland on Sunday: "If a heroin addict is down to his last £10, he will spend it on drugs and not food for his children. That is the tragic reality."

He added: "Everyone is aware of the risks of fire, emergency health problems or crime being committed, but where is the means for the public to communicate their most serious concerns about the plight of a child? Is this not a fourth type of emergency?

"This is one of the most serious problems that Scotland faces and we must deal with it."

The new drive is to be launched in February with an advertising campaign. The national child protection phoneline has been piloted in four parts of Scotland – Highland, Edinburgh, North East Scotland and Midlothian – but ministers now say they want to promote it nationwide.

The crackdown comes after Scotland's chief medical officer, Dr Harry Burns, warned that "alarming" numbers of children were living in chaotic homes where drug and alcohol abuse were harming their development. Across Scotland, one third of those on methadone treatment have a child under 16 living with them all, or part, of the time.

But Burns also admitted that social workers and police were unable to prevent severe harm to many other children, because they did not know about their parents' addictions.

Ewing said it could no longer be left to the state to monitor such families. Communities carried a "moral responsibility" to play their part as well.

The plans were backed by children's groups last night who said that too often neighbours did not know who to turn to when they were concerned about a child who was potentially in danger.

However, opposition parties said that social workers and

police would not be able to cope with the number of calls, and described the plans as "a gimmick".

Scots Tory leader Annabel Goldie said: "This represents a small step in the right direction and we welcome the fact that more children will be protected from the horrors of drug and alcohol abuse. However, it is still not the sea change in government attitude that we were promised and the SNP now needs to start matching their early rhetoric with action."

Duncan McNeil MSP, who has campaigned for tough action on drug addiction, said: "We have put a lot of responsibility on social workers, police and health boards. They have not got the resources to cope with the demand out there. Unless Fergus Ewing puts resources on the ground, they will not be able to cope."

Demands for drastic action to help children who live with drug abusers have increased markedly in recent months.

Last year, Professor Neil McKeganey, head of the Centre for Drug Misuse Research at Glasgow University, said CCTV cameras should be placed in the homes of drug-abusing parents, to ensure authorities could see they were looking after their children.

Former First Minister Jack McConnell said he supported moves to put such children into care, rather than let them stay at home.

A spokeswoman for the Scottish Government said: "In February we will be launching a national advertising campaign for the 24-hour gateway line to local child protection services, CPLine. The campaign will have a community focus, using local press and radio across the country to raise awareness that child protection is everybody's business.

"The campaign will encourage people to report concerns about a child being neglected or abused, including any concern about children affected by their parents' alcohol or drug misuse."



The full article contains 887 words and appears in Scotland On Sunday newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

RAV,

Alberta Canada 06/01/2008 00:14:31
Good for the kids. What about the rest of us? Last year my neighbour set fire to the semi-detached house I live in - he was cooking crack. After the fact other neighbours commented that there was a lot of "to & fro" esp in the pm when I was working & early am when I was asleep & when the fire started. Gee, thanks! Luckily no injuries.
2

Ross Fyffe,

Scotland 06/01/2008 00:17:04
there will be those that think grassing up is wrong, I on the other hand accept with gratitude the crimestoppers monety fort reporting drunk drivers, sorta feels like being a bounty hunter with no danger ...........
3

thewitness,

06/01/2008 00:38:23
#2
What else would you grass up for money "with no danger"?
4

famous 15,

Edinburgh 06/01/2008 00:39:02
Grassing is only a sin to the wicked bostards who hope to escape their wickedness by this nonsense prejudice they created. GRASS THEM UP EVERY TIME AND THEIR DEALERS YOU KNOW IT MAKES SENSE FOR YOU AND YOU KIDS
5

gggrumpy,

06/01/2008 00:59:55
let me be first to grass.
All the plebs who stand outside the chemists for their methadone substitute on a Monday morning with their poor wains waiting on them.
Doddle this, how much do i get paid for my info?
6

thewitness,

06/01/2008 01:01:59
I would like to say that i am shocked that an SNP admin would promote this idea, but i'm not.
The "protect the children" B.S does not wash with me.
There is always a "good reason" and then the "real reason". The real reason usually has to do with lawyers, jails, courts, experts, doctors, it's about money!
The SNP is a fake organisation of liers who practice communism!
7

thewitness,

06/01/2008 01:08:43
#4 and #5
Ever heard the saying..."mind your own business"?
I am in favour of law and order, if the govnt was serious they would hang a couple of hard drug dealers. I would hang them! They are not serious, they are liars. They should make the drugs legal OR hang the dealers!
8

gggrumpy,

06/01/2008 01:19:03
7*
Is taking your bairn to watch you swig your methadone neglect?
Let me think about it.
Thought about it.
Yes!
9

famous 15,

Edinburgh 06/01/2008 01:20:28
#6 you are crazeee!
10

Charles Linskaill,

.Edinburgh 06/01/2008 01:20:56
And what happens when you get the "Norris" of 'Corey' (Coronation street) coming alone,.. ??
Mr&Mrs 'Shopaholic' wont help atall!!
Imagine it! 'A BIG NEB' through your letter box!
Thanks... but... 'NO-Thanks'!
11

IainGlasgow,

06/01/2008 01:21:56
land of squealers and grasses
mother of the tell tale
how shall we dob thee
who are grassed by thee
12

thewitness,

06/01/2008 01:30:26
The East India Company - involvement with opium : a lucrative business
http://www.lib.cam.ac.uk/deptserv/rcs/opium/Captions.html

Off course the elite of today are not involved in drug dealing, no way! You would never find any elites, judges and solicitors shifting the smack in this day and age?

Glasgow solicitor admits laundering the proceeds of drug-trafficking - but escapes with a £5k fine
http://www.sacl.info/
13

thewitness,

06/01/2008 01:45:55
#7 and #9
Is there a BIGGER (ugly) picture to all of this? Nice website below, i'm scared to look through it, the front page is bad enough, take with a pinch of salt!
http://www.sacl.info/
The children AND drug addict parents are both victims of crime.
14

Karin M,

06/01/2008 01:50:41
"Duncan McNeil MSP, who has campaigned for tough action on drug addiction, said: "We have put a lot of responsibility on social workers, police and health boards. They have not got the resources to cope with the demand out there."

Duncan Mcneil is a nazi he wants to sterilise drug addicts thats his idea of getting tough.
15

Charles Linskaill,

.Edinburgh 06/01/2008 02:19:22
14 Karin M, well you 'said it'!
The..'POLICE-STATE'... is only getting stronger!
Informants to the cause, are like 'RED-CHINA'
Am I "Bovvered" ?...... YES!
16

Charles Linskaill,

.Edinburgh 06/01/2008 02:22:50
Who's THAT ? sticking their 'NEB' through my door Noo ?
Its nae our BW!
A good 'bunch-of-fives' will fix them!! :-)
17

thewitness,

06/01/2008 02:42:19
#15
Dont think i'm going to do "police state" very well!
18

Bend Over,

06/01/2008 02:44:18
Report your neighbours to the KGB so they can be sent to the Gulag for re-education purposes or execution if the re-education doesn't work.
19

Charles Linskaill,

.Edinburgh 06/01/2008 03:07:24
17 thewitness,
"Dont think i'm going to do "police state" very well!"

Dinny Worry aboot that!

Who wants to be a "Norris" out of Coronation Street anyway?
20

Dunnie,

Canada 06/01/2008 03:08:27

Dear Sir - I would like to report that last night I witnessed my parents sharing a a marijuanna stick. I believe subhumans refer to it as a joint.

By reporting this I believe I will be awarded my informants badge.

Oh yes, please put me down for the volunteer list for "Ganja-nacht".
21

Charles Linskaill,

.Edinburgh 06/01/2008 03:18:42
20 Dunnie, The Hitler Regime, has rewarded you with a,
'Stick-on-Gold-Star' :-)
22

AngelOfTruth,

06/01/2008 03:50:17
This daunts too much towards a police state.
23

MAMAorg,

Beaufort, SC USA 06/01/2008 04:40:37
Methadone is a lethal and unstable drug and the story of the little boys death is happening in my country as well. Currently in America Methadone is the #1 killer of prescription narcotics. Many of these deaths have occurred while under a doctors care.This only provides a replacement drug for those with addiction. Methadone is on the same level as many other drugs such as morphine, demerol, etc. but has found it's way into society legally. Methadone is legal, but addiction is still addiction and replacement drug therapy is not the answer. The United States is now being controlled by huge corporate drug companies and as we lose thousands of people to this drug a year our own government sits back and does nothing. Greed and money definately has the upper hand here and it is shameful.
Mothers Against Medical Abuse. Org (USA)
24

thewitness,

06/01/2008 04:47:09
#20 Dunnie

The SNP Youth are going to send you out...
A brown shirt, camera, phone card, whistle,
black knee length boots, arm band and a wee diary.
25

,

06/01/2008 05:07:25
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
26

Ross Fyffe,

06/01/2008 05:28:59
http://news.scotsman.com/latest-national-news/UK-39Islamists-creating-nogo-areas39.3644639.jp
27

thewitness,

06/01/2008 05:53:04
Minister for Community Safety Fergus Ewing told Scotland on Sunday: "If a heroin addict is down to his last £10, he will spend it on drugs and not food for his children. That is the tragic reality."

"If the government is down to his last £10, he will scurry round to the Bank Of England, tab £2 billion and spend it on an illegal war in Iraq and not on food and shelter for the children. That is the tragic reality."
The Witness.
28

thewitness,

06/01/2008 06:01:46
#26
Yes, the good Bishop fails to mention the No-Go area that has been created by Blair, Brown, chicken George and the Zionists, it's called Iraq! It's a no-go area for 35% of the Iraqi population, their dead!
The good bishop should stay out of politics!
29

Nellie,

UK 06/01/2008 07:50:21
#29 The voice of reason. I have seen the result of a child having been brought up by a junkie from birth to 4-5 years of age, before the welfare authorities found out he existed He's a lovely, bright kid, but he doesn't know how to behave because his Mum was always too stoned to teach him and flipping between angel and devil moods, while her druggy partner used to hit the child. He's in care and there is no place else for him because he is nigh on impossible to handle: like his parent and boyfriend, he flips between charm itself to punching, biting and kicking anyone and everyone when he gets upset, which anyone will know can be quite often with a child of that age. And wouldn't anyone think "something is wrong" when a 5 year old can tell you, in graphic detail, how to take heroin and crack? Not grass up the parent/s or guardians? It would be gross neglect NOT to grass them up, Police state or not!!!
30

KIMMETT THE KERMIT,

fremantle.WA 06/01/2008 08:23:07
I worked in drug infested north Glasgows Possilpark for 15 years as a police officer84-99 and during that time I was present when children of socially inadequate parents were taken into care.This measure was used as a last resort as there were few places to put the children.I can say that a large majority of the parents were young, uneducated,unemployed and hoplessly adrift in a sea of drugs and alcohol.In this area everybody knew who was a junkie and if the proposals aforementioned were applied to every family the social services would flounder.Incidentally there was never any shortage of informants in Possilpark and the police and social work departments worked to their limits but the evidence was plain to see in the form of addicts queing for methadone at Stonyhurst Street chemist.Politicians should get real and realise that we will never have a perfect society.
31

Rulesbutnotrulers,

Federation, not separation 06/01/2008 08:46:42
Drugs are NOT the problem.

The way we obtain and abuse them IS.

Solution is to sell them only through NHS clinics. This removes crime and pushing from the equation.

Can I grass on my unemployed neighbors who work in the black economy all day AND receive benefit?

Will any one actually do anything useful with all the info gathered?
32

Amani_Bunduki,

Canberra, Australia. 06/01/2008 09:14:10
I have been involved in an organisation helping people with drug and alcohol problems for ten years.

I always wonder why, in all of the great moralising and debating about drug and alcohol abuse - the reason why people are so empty and feel they need these substances (including the bottle) to improve their lives or perhaps make their lives more bearable.

American drug policy seems rarely to take into account the massive DEMAND for these things...

I have seen many drug and alcohol problems from living in government housing here in Canberra, Australia. Junkies who's infants died because mum was 'on the nod', malnourished children because mum spends all her money on smack and dad's either in jail or off the planet somewhere...

That all said... a friend has a drinking problem which I am certain interferes with her ability to take care of her children. Should I grass on her when this would only make her life more likely a continuous drinking session and would deprive the children of their mother.
The father is deceased... from cancer...

Big problem... no ONE policy or approach fits all. It is and likely will remain a Gordian knot. There is no sword (or mind) sharp enough to slice through it. Political will is weak and determined by opinion polls more than the good of all people in a society.

If a parent is endangering their children - shop them.
It's f**king hard and cold but so is the truth and they need to face it.

emeraldsandash.blogspot.com
33

an interested party,

06/01/2008 09:26:34
why not grass any child you suspect that is being abused not just those of drink or drug users.

we could have a secret class of citizen (oh ok subjects) that could pass on information to the government of the day and this could be used to coerce or blackmail each other for profit

we could call it the Stasi
34

Unimpressed one,

06/01/2008 09:39:31
The concept of 'grassing' will obviously make many uncomfortable and indeed, will be deeply offensive to others. But how many innocents could have been saved if 'concerned' neighbours had some way of officially reporting suspected child abuse. Tragic how they all seemed to 'know' something was not right after it's too late.
35

JimC,

Kilmarnock 06/01/2008 10:09:00
There is nothing new here other than a dedicated phone line. IT has always been the case that social services are duty bound to investigate all reported claims of abuse, even those where the caller refused to give their name and address.
36

bill-alba,

Fife 06/01/2008 10:32:54
Grassing on your neigbours...Sorry but if you are concerned about any sort of abuse of children you should have been taking action anyway (not particularly calling the polis) not just sitting there with your head in the sand...neighbours used to take an interest in what was going on around them.
37

calum,

06/01/2008 11:13:40
So some posters on here seem to be suggesting that if they knew of a child who was being abused or neglected because of the addictions/behaviour of their parents then they would keep quiet about it. How many examples have we had of children beaten or killed or starved because "it's none of my business" or "we don't like to interfere"? Silence is complicity.
38

Dhana,

The back of beyond 06/01/2008 11:20:03
The bigger reality here is not the safety of the children, but the safety of the people who they want to report the drug users in.

I live in a pretty run down part of town where there are a lot of drug users. These people, while under the influence the majority of the time, are NOT stupid and can figure out who "rats" them out. Not only that, but if these cases do come to full fruition and criminal charges are laid, you would be required as a witness in a trial. There is no such thing as "confidentiality".

I'm all for protecting children and trying to get them out of bad situations...after all, they shouldn't have to have bad lives because of the bad decisions and judgements made on their parents' parts...but I think that if the government seriously wants to introduce this, they need to put more measures in place. The Children's Panel is already buckling under the huge influx of cases coming through and in the Courts we're seeing a huge rise in drug users coming through but not enough spaces in rehabilitation to help them...have the govt thought about the knock on effect that this will have on all areas of Criminal and Social practices??

I wonder.
39

C U Jimmy,

Ayrshire 06/01/2008 11:24:26
Lets get serious with the dealers, I mean REAL serious, the sentences should be as harsh as the misery they cause, stop pussyfooting and let them know we mean business.
40

Kipling,

06/01/2008 11:49:14
#39 & #40. Several years ago a major (but dislikable) newspaper down south quizzed Westminster ministers on whether or not they had smoked or whatever drugs at any point. Only the Tories responded openly, the Labour party ministers refused to answer. Having been in work myself where I have had to deal with those some way or another involved with drugs, the question towards the Labour ministers should have been not whether they had taken any drugs but whether they had DEALT in them. Their refusal to respond could be better considered in that light. ALL of the general working public I dealt with, (mainly the average hard working blue collar person) where the question of drug dealing came up, thought the police were involved in one way or another. So, looking at the issue of confidentiality, there may be other reasons why it would be dangerous for an informant. It doesn't surprise me that at least two police chiefs down south want to legalise the softer drugs, they're possibly protecting their drug-taking junior officers. Those that I met doing cocaine and similar level drugs included by & large Guardian newspaper reader types: those most likely to apply for social services roles. I for one wouldn't be confident in those policing the ratting on negligent neighbours, particularly where immigrant families are involved due to a blinding level of PC in the social services & police. That being said, some avenue to do something about neglected/abused kids regardless of the reason needs to be there.
41

daveserviceman,

edinburgh 06/01/2008 11:56:29
This sort of thing used to go on in Nazi germany and the soviet union, everyone there was told to report family and neighbours if they didnt support the government ect.
this smacks of a communist scottish government and should be stopped in its tracks there are other ways of flagging up child abuse.
42

Charles Linskaill,

.Edinburgh 06/01/2008 11:59:49
So whats the new 'Scottish-Red-Flag' Design.?
43

Justy,

Edinburgh 06/01/2008 12:09:15
If people wish to abuse themselves they have that right. I have the same right NOT to clype on them, unless my life is in danger, to police or anyone else.

Justy.
44

Kipling,

06/01/2008 12:31:42
#42. Dave, you're confusing two things.
--One is reporting people for lacking a normative lifestyle where this bears on political or anti-establishment or anti-anti-establishment views; in some countries, still now, even the kids were & are encouraged to report their parents' political views.
--the other is a general concern for the condition of a child as a result of a lifestyle provably resulting from parental drug or alchohol abuse.
You might say that deciding the physical or mental condition is a normative decision. Some dirty kids might enjoy life. Some kids from strict 'clean' backgrounds don't. Where there were checks in small communities before, though small community care was/is not always blameless -- look at the way Africans might be told their children are harbouring the devil and the abuse meeted out by the family upon the child as encouraged by that community (hence the use of a social anthropologist with African experience to participate in the examination of social services behaviour in the widely publicised Orkney children case). But if you have a situation where people find it easier to report neglected children, fear of being reported & losing the kids might actually (some hope, but it might do) cause them to revise their own lifestyles WHERE they have kids. My worry is to whom the reporting is being done. To call them 'police' or 'social services' does not mean they have not been corrupted by some fashionable addiction or attitude which shrinks their brains physically and mentally. Second, if the kid doesn't want alternative care, then the kid's wishes should be paramount perhaps.
45

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 06/01/2008 12:47:43
-- but whether they had DEALT drugs

These would be Tories who would rise to be local businessmen and owning football teams and taxis. Their children get sent to expensive schools to further the family skills. Hedge funding and private equity beckons and after a successful career in the City of London casino-economy, retire early to the Carribean.
46

simpleton,

Edinburgh 06/01/2008 12:49:59
Just great, first you shop your next door neighbors, so you get your head kicked in, then the poor kids are put into care were they will no doubt come out of there more affected than when they went in,you only have to read the newspapers to know what the staff at these places get up to with kids,, not the best idea in the world, but where do you actually start to solve this drug and alcohol problem, i dont think it will work...
47

inkster,

06/01/2008 12:57:11
the grass is greener on the other side
48

Kipling,

06/01/2008 13:23:55
#46. I knew the City was inhabited by cocaine sniffers but I didn't realise this was to add to daddy's income. I have been told that Essex, a Tory heartland, supplies many a city worker. Are the two related? On the other hand, since major support for the city as the be & end all world's leading financial services centre comes from Labour mughead Ken Livingstone (to be knighted for services to newts) perhaps the real Mr BIG behind these Tory dealers, as you allege, might actually be a pinko!? Perhaps even Mr 100% (ie, chairman gordon-bleu) might have his finger in the cocainy pie, eh?
49

Kipling,

06/01/2008 13:26:52
-- or since I was referring to the City, should I have said "a share in the cocainy pye"?
50

Kipling,

06/01/2008 13:29:26
--with a bit of methadone stock thrown in.
51

Kipling,

06/01/2008 13:38:17
#53

all these leader dots, CG. are you trying to tell us something about your predecessor?
52

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 06/01/2008 14:24:11
Had Annabel Goldie dealt drugs in her youth, there would, of course, be no paper trail, yet one wonders how she got her finance and eminence. She has the look of a successful cartel matriarch but this could be deceptive. Chairman Gordon (who said communism was extinct in Scotland?) will further dis-inform us.
53

Jimmy the Pie,

06/01/2008 14:34:55
The Witless - various posts

Are you the full shilling??
Are you a drug addict?
Something certainly has addled your brain.
54

Kipling,

06/01/2008 14:42:13
But hopefully sometime in the future not fEUdal, Gordy. Everything done by the Labour party has been to enhance drinking, drug taking and gambling, which is not that it didn't exist before (of course it did) but Mr 100%-err has simply encouraged it with availability of the means to shrink the brain. How convenient now that systems to monitor this will be cross-referenced all across the country, so someone who has fallen into the pit of alcoholism & drug taking, will never seriously leave that past behind even when the kids have grown up & left. Worse, those with access to the records, may well find a new market to push into.
55

Banana Heid,

Ayrshire 06/01/2008 14:48:23
Why not take it a step further and have all known drug users sew a yellow star onto their clothing. That way we will know to avoid them until the government implement a solution to eradicate the problem once and for all!
56

Allan(handofgod137),

06/01/2008 14:58:08
Why not take the simple approach 1st, and ban anyone on benefits from breeding? or would this cut into the socialist core vote?
57

OLD GIN,

METHIL LEVEN 06/01/2008 15:32:48
WHY NOT GET TAXI DRIVERS TO REPORT DRUG HOUSE WHERE THEY SELL. I SEE MANY IN LEVEN AREA PULL UP AT HOUSE PERSON KNOCKS ON DOOR OR WINDOW GETS PKT 2 MINS BACK IN CAR. THEY KNOW WHY DONT THEY REPORT, OR RISK THE FIRMS LICENCE AS THEY KNOW AS WELL ,
58

celticsnowdrop,

greenock 06/01/2008 15:50:21
heard it all !!!! so it seems most people tend to put their heads in the ground and pretent that this problem will never effect them........just like the families of drug addicts......shut your eyes and it will go away, OR.....you can wait till it knocks your door and the ones you spoke about are now the ones laughing at you.......and all of a sudden your family is the talk of the community. It is the moral right of everyone to give children a chance of a decent life for they are the future.........are you telling me there are more drug addicts in the comunity than decent law abiding people. Would the people be so afraid if they were fighting for their child or are they more afraid that it could be their child, so lets not kid ourselves, shutting our eyes to (what was ) (what is ), or (what could be ) wont help what WILL BE.......for that depends on the population doing their bit for a decent society.
59

Kipling,

06/01/2008 15:53:13
#60. Why keep turning me in the direction of the Scandinavian countries? Has someone told you of those intrepid, adventurous, handsome, attractive, intelligent Vikings 1000plus years up part of my genealogical tree? Who told you? Unpermissible access to my records! At least outside the EU the records are restricted to that country. Within the EU we have a CCCP-type environment.

Well, the best, squire, that I could find related to the strictness of Swedish laws, at (no gaps) http://www.parl.gc.ca/37/1/ parlbus/commbus/senate/com-e/ille-e/ library-e/gerald-e.htm#C.%20%20Penalties. However, this is dated 2002.
"The Swedish vision of a drug-free society is so widely accepted that it is not questioned in the political arena or the media. The drug policy has support from all political parties and, according to the opinion surveys, the restrictive approach receives broad support from the public. ... Supporting the restrictive policy, or even asking for more restrictive measures to curb increase in the drug problem are essential for a political party to win votes. Saying the contrary, to back a more liberal approach, is not an option for a political party and would almost mean its political death. It has been pointed out that anti-drug pressure groups have been the driving forces behind influencing public opinion, and through them the political parties. It has also been shown that besides the social movements, the media have also contributed to the drug scare that exists today and the defining of drugs as a major social problem. ... Scientists are generally the only group that raises doubts with respect to the current policy. Criticism of the drug policy can have negative consequences on a person. For example, they may be professionally and personally criticized, they may be regarded as a traitor, and, such a stance can have a negative impact on their employment situation."
(Sounds like what Labour & Tories did to SNP supporters up till recently.)
"The numbe
60

Kipling,

06/01/2008 15:53:44
[contd.]
"The number of suspected people who were reported has increased from 6,567 in 1985 to 12,470 in 1999. ...In 1998, 92% were suspected for use or possession (from 76% in 1975). In addition, the number of those suspected of selling or manufacturing is now 19% (from 40% in 1975)..."

MORE GENERALLY:
See especially page 5 of http://www.mobilisera.nu/upload/costa.pdf for 2006 statement from UN on the drugs problems, the relative death rate compared to other addictions, the failure to be consistent about drug policies and attitude to cocaine.
61

OscarMacApfel,

Dumfropolis 06/01/2008 16:28:50
It never ceases to amaze me that when a child is abused or even worse murdered by a neglectful mother and/or partner, the neighbourhood worthies delight in telling everyone in earshot 'how they knew about it all along.' Yet they never report any suspected abuse, instead they expect social workers and the police to be equipped with telepathetic powers.

I doubt this proposed 'whistleblowing' legislation will do much to encourage the worthies to actually get off their arrse and report suspected abuse.
62

thewitness,

06/01/2008 16:37:25
Get rid of income tax and all politicians that support income tax! If we did not have income tax to pay, then we could have a thriving charity sector where people with addiction problems could get help from people with skills who act as volunteers, instead of useless parasitic government workers who do not have the skills to deal with social issues. The government sector is a sickness and the last place for disadvantaged children and parents to be cared for, our politiians are child abusers by association, with criminal usury!
63

Grumpster,

West Coast 06/01/2008 16:38:27
Part of the problem is we have a generation that have grown up 'knowing their rights'. Only problem is, they may know their 'rights' but very few know their 'responsibilities' and how to live up to those responsibilities...

Until we return to a culture where respect for the rights of others is as important as the right of the individual then we will always have this problem where the abuser/drunk/thief/violent thug gets treated better than the law abiding person.

Who deserves help more the disabled house bound woman with kids or the druggie with kids who goes out nicking?

So often the help is targeted at the latter.. a person who has no resepct for others rights.. yet alway claims their own.

If you cannot live up to the responsibilities that your right afford you then should you really have those rights?
64

Kipling,

06/01/2008 17:10:00
#71. Is that your resignation speech, Chairman?
65

John Blackley,

Austin, TX 06/01/2008 17:40:08
Though I hate to interrupt the usual slagfest that goes on in this forum, I do have a question or two.

Say, while we're wearing our fantasy hats, that this latest "grass your neighbour" effort does have an effect and users, dealers, etc. are reported to the police and/or social workers - what then?

Are the police so effective nowadays and the social workers so under-employed that they'll have the time and inclination to do anything about it?
66

far enough away from skotland to feel safe...,

paris 06/01/2008 17:52:46
methinks 'the witless' is in need of a bit of therapy himself... btw th' SNP ain't a commie organisation- I'm a member and I'm a freakin' anarchist. I've said it b4 and I'll say it again- Free smack for life in return for voluntary sterilisation... is that so bad?
67

Red Mark,

Munchen 06/01/2008 18:33:56
Children's health and safety is paramount,well done Scottish Government.

The flaw in this may be the lack of places of safety,foster carers etc.
68

Publius,

London 06/01/2008 18:35:15
#74 John Blackley You're right about police and social workers being too busy. Lawyers too. I hear the Good Samaritan parable has been updated. There was a battered, naked man lying in the street on a dark night. A lawyer driving by slowed down to have a look and thought: "There's no money in a legal aid casse like this". The lawyer drove on. A police car drove by and slowed down. The cop thought "Another drunk or druggie. If I put him in the car he'll be sick all over it and I'll spend all night fulling report forms in". The cop drove on. A social worker drove up, saw the man lying in the street and thought "This is terrible. Whoever did this needs help." The social worker drove on.
69

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 06/01/2008 18:36:08
68...Fathers dont murder their children then?
70

Waspy100,

06/01/2008 18:48:58
Kipling /Ghairman gorgan
Go back to making cakes and ruling the masses you are becoming boring
71

GalacticCannibal,

Murrieta 06/01/2008 18:50:32
In reality , CHILDREN have no rights , no protection. They are the AFTER little people.

You would not be far out if u estimated, that 40% to 60% of adult homo-sapiens are buckets of biological scum. Our planet would be well rid of this human scourge.

GC

72

Waspy100,

06/01/2008 19:04:24
#75
and a double dose if you are a good boy
73

Harry Carnie,

B.C. Canada 06/01/2008 19:07:01
Cannot speak for you people in Scotland...but for us here in Canada..would say WHY BOTHER? (Reporting to the authorities)
We give our rapists, murderers, child molesters, terrorists..a "slap on the wrist" IF THEY ARE convicted.
Which only happens on rare occassions
74

Waspy100,

06/01/2008 19:09:53
Apologies. I seem to becoming less compassionate in my old age. Time I stopped logging onto these forums.
75

thewitness,

06/01/2008 19:14:42
#75
If the SNP take the income tax, they are communists.
The income tax was the main plank of the commie manifesto,written (supposedly) by Karl Marx in LONDON!
If you want to debate the facts -Bring it on!
76

Jeff, Surrey,

06/01/2008 19:26:50
160,000 Scottish children in drug and alcohol abusive households.

Guess what, it does not take a rocket scientist to note that the vast majority of these households will be single parents, or single parents with new partners.

Where the father is not involved at all or with very little input, either because he is a waster or as many fathers is not able to be involved due to the present system that systematically removes fathers from children's lives.

These children like their parents are likely destined to a life on drugs and alcohol where the problems just continue to grow.

Until you empower families (fathers and mothers equally) and communities to be responsible for children, throwing naive, indoctrinated, middle class Social Workers at them (even if you had the numbers) will be a waste of their's and everybody elses time and money.

We need a radical rethink on how we raise our children, many other countries get it a lot right than we do, we are the worst.

Broon and his failed single parent promoting policies (excluding fathers and paternal extended family) has possibly damaged our society irrevocably, but here's hoping I'm just beeing a tad pessimistic.

1 in 3 children in poor families do not consider their father part of their family.

1 in 4 children of all families do not consider their father part of their family.

That is 3/4 million + children in the UK. Good grief.
77

thewitness,

06/01/2008 19:37:50
#75
There is a simple test for the SNP, come out in public and state that the monetary policy of an Independant Scottish Government will be...

Policy -The Scottish Govnt will print it's own money debt free, for the economy, public services and trade, the Govnt will control the supply of money and credit. There will be no central bank in Scotland.
If a person or persons attempt to create a central bank the penalty will be death.

Will the SNP do this? No! Case closed!
78

Firozali A.Mulla MBA PhD,

Dar-Es-Salaam Tanzaia 06/01/2008 20:17:09
Sir
"SCOTS are being urged to shop their neighbours to police and social workers if they suspect they are neglecting their children because of drug addiction or alcohol abuse."
I am not one and I do not want to urge any reader to get upset on my comments
The days are gone to look for the drunken ones. Is not the time these days to look at my own roof rather then Tom's roof that I am not sure how he got this and that I am also not sure if Tom is telling me truth about his financial ratios as he has to pay me some amount. It is a farce that I care about the drunk. Why they got pissed up in the first place any way. Okay. I am a Good Samaritan and I am prepared to help. The cops take so long to get the statements right from me that I seem to miss my time in office. With money less in my pocket let me be very frank. I am not interested in the neighbours these days. In 6os the theme,"Look after your neighbours, you will go to heaven", did little. I am still around and broke trying to live on my savings. This is the picture not of me but all over plastered on the wall. It just so happens that I speak, many keep quite.
79

Firozali A.Mulla MBA PhD,

Dar-Es-Salaam 06/01/2008 20:22:01
This is what I mean, who am I manager of the mother earth sent here by the creator to keek the peace level at the optimum. NO says I . If the police and the elected voted politicians cannot do this and spent my votes and my tax money in hopeless holes, I am not doing anything till I get the surety that my cash or my time I spend will be appreciated and noted somewhere after my death, say on the stone that is on the head or scalp call this then.......just read this why I am pissed up...
Duncan McNeil MSP, who has campaigned for tough action on drug addiction, said: "We have put a lot of responsibility on social workers, police and health boards. They have not got the resources to cope with the demand out there. Unless Fergus Ewing puts resources on the ground, they will not be able to cope."
80

I'mallymax,

Orwellian 06/01/2008 21:22:42
#85, Jeff from Surrey has made a very valid point; where's the father in all this mess?

The suppossed 'service institutions' like the police, social work, and the law officers, (procurator fiscals, judges, courts staf etc), work against families staying together. They make it easy to demonize men with all their nasty propoganda. Scotland's own lord advocate angiolini blasts out radical feminist leanings by stating Scotland is the rape capitol of the world. Scotland's 8 police chiefs demand more power from the citizen in an already totalitarian regime to combar domestic violence. The law officers of Scotland are criminalizing the Scots populace, (100% more in prison than 10 years ago), and the messages coming from quango's and the law commission is that of divide and conquer. Who benefits from this Orwellian nightmare? The 'elites' of Scotland, that's who!

There's an old saying, without criminals there would be no police. The emphasis by the elites are to make criminals of Scots peoples. This way the police can say they need more power, more coppers, and more say on social culture. 95% of Scotland's prisons are full with men. When a man gets a criminal record, (a police charge even without a conviction), he finds it very hard to get a job. This is a way the elites of Scotland are dividing the have from have-nots.

'Grass-up' your neighbour' now coming off the back that Scots men are a nation of domestic violators/rapists, and '1/4 women experience domestic violence'. That should read 1/4 men, women and their children experience domestic violence! But why the divisive propoganda? because the elites need families breaking-up, getting the cops involved, going through the courts, and getting divorced. The elites are like sharks, they are soul-less. They don't care what happens to the poor of Scotland just as long as they get their elite positions and salaries. The fact is men/fathers are being forced out of their families by these elites that live off our famliie
81

Ard Righ,

The Rock Of Edinburgh 06/01/2008 21:44:01
The state has no business in the nations dwellings.

The state has no business wasting money on lost causes.

Stop wasting substitutes on them, lop off their balls and whip out their eggs, use them for target practice if they are that bad.
82

Pinkpanther,

Edinburgh 06/01/2008 22:25:38
I live in an area of Edinburgh where the level of drug and alcohol abuse is bordering on the extreem.
I think being able to confidentially pass on knowledge of abuse linked to this is a great idea. I have myself seen first hand the effects it has on children living where I do.
You would never let this happen to your own child so why let it happen to someone elses?
Think about it you could potentially be saving a life!
83

Brian Hill,

Edinburgh 07/01/2008 03:57:36
This is one of the least clever ideas the SNP have come up with. The Nazis popularised it but history tells us that using the civilian population to snoop on each other is old hat. Great for the authorities, not so good for the population as a whole.

The only chance of it working would be for the authorities to have trained support staff to work closely with these families. And if you think that would be too costly how much do you think it will cost to keep errant parents in prison or kids in care homes.

Of course were the Government to do the brave thing and lead from the front they would decriminalise all drugs and have all addicts registered at clinics where they would be given their daily dose in their arm or down their throat in a controlled manner.

The extra cost would be met by the huge savings in police money, time and effort in dealing with the crime associated with addicts getting the funds to feed their habit.

Anything else is throwing good money after bad. This so called 'war against drugs' has been going on for 50 years and the situation has been getting worse year on year. Time for a major radical rethink, not just by the SNP but the whole parliament.
84

Wee Willie Winkie III,

Fallbrook 07/01/2008 06:11:12
When we learn to care for each other and stop passing the buck this will end.
85

Jimmy the Pie,

07/01/2008 09:42:38
There should be an appeal to shop Wendy. Someone must know where she and her criminal cohorts are holed up?? She might have fled the country and I have heard rumours that she is holed up at a hoose in Downing Street, London. What about an early morning raid there?
86

Reckless,

Fife 07/01/2008 20:10:32
Sounds like something from Stalin's Russia.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/