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'I'm overwhelmed by a feeling that I'm nearing the end of my life'

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Published Date: 28 January 2007
THIS weekend is a bitterly sad one for me. It marks the moment when I reach 20 years on Death Row. Yes, that's right: I have lived - or rather existed in a sort of half-life - for two full decades awaiting either justice or death at the hands of my jailers in an American penitentiary.
Some readers will know my name. That's partly down to the tireless awareness-raising work of Scottish anti-death penalty campaigner Karen Torley, as well as human rights organisations Amnesty International and Reprieve.

Ending up in prison is bad enough for most people. Finding yourself in prison for a crime you didn't commit is at least twice as bad. But to have both of these things happen and to be sent to Death Row is, I would argue, almost unendurable. It's truly a nightmare.

Yet this is what has happened to me. This judicial living interment has come about because of the inflexibility of a US justice system that finds it almost impossible to correct mistakes that occur in capital trials.

When I was sentenced to death on January 27, 1987, I was shocked and appalled. It was a tragic mistake - I hadn't killed anyone and certainly hadn't started a fire that killed a small child in a block of apartments in Columbus Grove, Ohio, in 1986. In fact, no one had - it was an accidental fire and there was no crime and no criminal.

But still, mistakes happen, even terrible ones, and I would surely get the courts to realise that the US justice system had indeed made a terrible error in my case - just as it had in the 123 cases where a Death Row prisoner has been exonerated and set free in the US since 1973.

My case though has become trapped in a vicious cycle of "shoddy justice" denounced by Amnesty International and others.

My lawyers have this week been back in the courts, arguing that there is vital evidence that could certainly set me free if properly reviewed by a court. But, amazingly, it's still not clear whether US justice is able to accommodate this simple request.

So how do I feel about reaching this terrible milestone of 20 years in the shadow of the executioner?

Fundamentally, the years have taken a huge toll on me, both emotionally and physically.

My physical health has suffered immensely. Sometimes I pace my cell back and forth for an hour, hoping to tire myself out a little. Six steps from one end of the cell to the other - or four decent steps.

Psychologically, the torment is acute. I try to pass my time by reading books about Scotland and its history. This makes me feel even more homesick, but at the same time brings me a little closer to home.

At other times I sit here in this cell for hours at a time, just losing myself in thoughts of the past.

The other day I sat in the dark for hours thinking about the past. Memories of happier times in a childhood now long ago lost. My youth in Edinburgh. My family and friends. It seems at times that the past is all I have. I cling so desperately to it. Even sleep is difficult on Death Row. A guard conducting an inspection will periodically come by and shine a light into my face in the cell.

And it's not dark in the cell anyway. A large floodlight in the compound outside shines through my window. The window is six inches wide and 22 inches long. It doesn't open, so there is never any fresh air.

Receiving letters is a big part of what keeps me going. The more mail I get, the better I am able to cope with this nightmare. I doubt that anyone who hasn't experienced imprisonment could really understand just how important receiving letters is.

My half-life is permanently on hold, but after 20 years it seems to be approaching some kind of resolution. I estimate that in two years' time I will either have been executed or will have got lucky and have finally won my freedom. Time is running out quickly. Unless the courts give me a fair crack at having my case heard properly, I fear the worst. This living hell has changed me. I'm no longer 'me' anymore. I feel completely lost and alone most of the time. After 20 years in this dungeon it's all finally starting to beat me down. I know if I don't get out of here soon, then I won't be getting out at all.

I'm often overwhelmed by a strong feeling that I'm nearing the end of my life, and I keep recalling that it's been 20 years for a crime I didn't commit - a crime that never was.

This weekend, then, is a black 'anniversary' for me. But I'll carry on fighting to clear my name. What else can I do?

Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 28 January 2007 12:57 AM
  • Source: Scotland On Sunday
  • Location: Scotland
  • Related Topics: Kenny Richey
 
1

www.scottwebb.co.uk,

28/01/2007 01:30:09

Quote: 'I'm overwhelmed by a feeling that I'm nearing the end of my life'
With the war on terror, WMDs, global warming, end of oil and about another 1000 cheery things.........i don't think your own your own with that view dude

2

Paul Voltaire,

www.paulvoltaire.spaces.live.com 28/01/2007 02:21:26

Kenny Richey has been treated abysmally by the US legal system.
I am amazed he still has his sanity intact.

3

www.scottwebb.co.uk,

28/01/2007 02:55:59

Comment@2 Agreed Paul, the British government could be doing a heck of a lot more for the guy as well

4

Voldemort,

Musselburgh 28/01/2007 03:17:37

I don't know what if and but are about this case but crims should rot in hell. We should be bringing back the death penalty and corpral punishment for crims in Scotland ... make them suffer like their victims ... but that's all forgotton with todays wishy washy liberal lefty human rights handout monkeys ...

Jail problems? just pack'em in - if they riot then just let them get on with it ... they clearly don't care about us - why should we roll out the red carpet for them ?!

5

www.scottwebb.co.uk,

28/01/2007 03:59:24

For those that asked http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenny_Richey

Described by Amnesty International as ‘one of the most compelling cases of apparent innocence that human rights campaigners have ever seen

6

www.scottwebb.co.uk,

28/01/2007 04:04:53

http://en.allexperts.com/e/k/ke/kenny_richey.htm

Theres loads of others, I'm sure the gun hoe witch hunt brigade can go look for

7

www.scottwebb.co.uk,

28/01/2007 04:13:46

And heres all Amnesty Internationals info on Kenny Richey http://www.amnesty.org.uk/search.asp?q=+Kenny+Richey&...

8

www.scottwebb.co.uk,

28/01/2007 04:16:48

http://www.amnesty.org.uk/ and on their front page

9

MarkB,

28/01/2007 05:49:36

And of course Amnesty International can be trusted when it comes to the death penalty. They would never lie to get someone off of death row, would they?

According to them, if you want to find an innocent person, you should look in a prison - they're all unjustly persecuted. Just like all the British Muslims wandering around Afghanistan during a war were just looking for wives.

10

Chris MacInnes,

Edinburgh, SCOTLAND 28/01/2007 06:22:40

What several capital punishment supporters are stating about justice etc is missing the point. Even if you do believe that execution is the answer to our current prison overcrowding system and that it is the best deterrant to possible offenders surely you at least believe that there should be a trial?

If people can be jailed and told that no further examination of their case is possible.. even after 20 years of imprissonment... then it simply isn't justice.

If the courts are so sure of someones guilt they should have no problem allowing fresh evidence, which is frequently found and used in other cases to prove peoples complete innocence, to be presented and argued for and against. By failing to offer a basic right such as this they immediatly become the criminals.

It is people like the very adult named Voldemort and MarkB that are allowing crimes such as Guantánamo Bay Detainment Camp to continue... happy to ignore something they have no concept of while people are held against International Law in our armed forces' names.

Amenesty International being called liars in a dicussion about freedom! ... have you followed any of the links added by Scott Webb or are you safe and secure your opinions are 100% researched and correct?

Read up, Speak Up and for your own sake Grow Up.

11

Ian_,

usa 28/01/2007 06:54:50

I would have preferred an article about the case by a Scotsman reporter, rather than an account authored by Mr Richey. He's facing execution and cannot be expected to provide an unbiased view of his circumstances.

Still, I'm opposed to capital punishment. In this country they execute as dictated by the prevailing political climate. Clinton and Bush both approved executions around the times of their presidential campaigns. The US legal system is vicious when it comes to capital punishment; give us your poor, weak, mentally-impaired, innocent, women and children (under eighteen) and we'll put them death. For what purpose? Politics, ultimately, whether it's to appear strong to satisfy a need for vengeance, or to satisfy the religious groups. The religious groups? They're as blood-thirsty as any.

The US considers itself very advanced but, with respect to capital punishment, it is as backward and unenlightened as any nation in history.

12

Guga,

Rockall 28/01/2007 07:06:19

#11 Chris. Well said.

13

Hoop,

At liberty 28/01/2007 08:04:47

#11 Chris, I'll second that.

14

Sholtodhr,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 08:25:00

Isnt Kenny Richey the argument against capital punishment. He may be guilty but the striking amount of evidence suggesting he was not involved suggests that this is a major miscarriage of justice.

Capital punishment does not reduce the crime rate: good policing, effective justice and social community are the most effective brriers to criminality.

15

Firozali A.Mulla MBA PhD,

Dar-Es-Salaam Tanzania 28/01/2007 09:07:19

KENNY Richey, the Scot who has been on Death Row in the US for 20 years, says that time is running out for him
Kenny. There is one thing that we are all petrified with is the visit to the hospital, another one to the custom and excise and the third the prison. The reason is simple. There are too many lawyers, officials and doctors probing into your veins to find out what ails you. The prison is the worst as there is no one to listen to you. I just read there more prisoners in UK then the jails can hold. Now tell me, what one does with this situation?. Besides, there is Abu Garib and Guantanamo another example and yet the worst is the hidden prisons, not the prisoners but the houses that hold the prisoners not visible, till the report leaks out that the super power are distorting the truth. What can you expect from this?
Only thing I can say is hold on. There is a hope. You are still alive. Don’t make the guys feel they have got you exhausted. This is one of their baffling tricks. They will get you tired and then you give up. Don’t let any one rule your life as long as you have this use with you. No one has a right to take your life except the creator. All others are money makers and will mock at your cowardice. Don’t give them a chance. Live to the last minute. Changes are there,. You will see this. My prayers are with you.

Richey: caught in 'a vicious cycle of shoddy justice'. Picture: Susan Burrell


Dr. Firozali A.Mulla MBA PhD
P.O.Box 6044
Dar-Es-salaam
Tanzania
East Africa
+255713405411

16

Firozali A.Mulla MBA PhD,

Dar-Es-Salaam Tanzania 28/01/2007 09:09:38

I give my full name as I am least scared of all of these man made slow bombs that seep the laughter out of you. Dont let them do this. Not to you not to any one. We do not have Human Rights. They are all wrongs. If there were we would not have the above.

17

JG,

Fife 28/01/2007 09:21:11

I really have no problem with keeping violent criminals, murderers and child abusers in jail for a very long time, but should we not at least make sure they are guilty first?

18

Scaramouche,

28/01/2007 09:37:02

I'm one of those who do believe in an eye for an eye and bringing back the death penalty for murderers.

But each case would have to to be thoroughly investigated until every fact established is exactly that.

I've followed this guy's case, read all I can and concluded that he is, most probably innocent and there is something rotten at the heart of the US Justice System.

19

Stefanie,

28/01/2007 09:43:27

What a poignant title and what a poignant tale...

I am sorry that our society is so troubled and that injustice and man-made death exists. Whether it be "justice, in justice, war or poverty.

I am sorry that this depth of experience has to be made by anyone.

I do not judge. What do *I* know about this case or the rights and wrongs of a judicial system? Only one person knows the real truth and that is the author himself (so why do some feel they have the right to pontificate? Why not JUST read it for what it is and react to how it makes them FEEL?) and that is as it must be.

I hope and pray, and it costs ME little as I still have my freedom and can rise and smell the icey air of a Winter's morning, that justice, whatever it is, IS done.

My belief is that no one deserves to die. People deserve to be accountable but that does not include dying. Don't ask me what form that accountability should take- I am not arguing the toss.

I simply responded to the human tragedy of this piece, written by a man with a unique and very sad experience. And I respect it as such (who REALLY WANTS a reporter's take? Not sick of sensationalisation yet?! LOL! I am!) and on that note wish him well.

20

rab, glasgow,

28/01/2007 10:14:25

17. Firozali A.Mulla MBA / This is what kenny is up against .http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/famous/shep...

21

Weedram,

Erskine 28/01/2007 10:28:54

Guilty or innocent 20 years is enough. Turn him loose.

22

Media 1,

cape town 28/01/2007 10:37:55

Who killed Kenny?

23

Joel,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 10:55:02

The US courts are not mugs like ours, where the system is overloaded in favour of the criminal and many go Scot free.

24

Alex H,

Ayrshire 28/01/2007 11:42:33

20 years is already a lift sentence and let be honest there have been similar crimes in the world where we have seen people released quicker.

I am not debating whether he is guilty or not, but he was convicted and has now paid the sentence for this crime ie 2 years banged up.

Can T Blair not get involved in this?

25

Alex H,

Ayrshire 28/01/2007 11:43:07

not 2, 20 years banged up!

26

Joel,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 11:46:15

No - 20 years is absolutely not life. Read what it rightly says on the American tin!

27

busbyfth,

28/01/2007 11:50:21

Hope he gets what he is deserving of - whichever way it is. Mind you a fire starter (If there was one)
would have been out of prison in the UK having served his time.Maybe we are too lax.Maybe not.
They should allow this stonewall evidence to be produced - It is the least they might do.

28

Tosher,

UK 28/01/2007 12:04:36

The US Courts are not mugs? No, they're simply corrupt in some instances, which is worse. Prosecutorial Misconduct, drunken defense lawyers (and the reasoning on that one being excusable to the Judge was - we said we'd provide you with a lawyer. We didn't say he'd have to be sober or awake.) You have insane people walking the streets that aren't given help in America, but when they do commit a murder, they'll fight to give them the meds to bring them back to lucidity long enough so they can execute them - that's happened before. The Death Penalty is great for the State prosecutors, but not good for the Defendant or the victim's family as it's long and drawn-out, and the reason it's long and drawn-out and clauses added to the law is because they get it wrong. That extra time allows for them to get it right, which means rush to conviction, and deal with the consequences as we go along. Ten States now have the DP on hold for various reasons, 123 people released from Death Row, and that doesn't include the non-DR Innocents who've also been released. That must surely tell you something about the system, and how screwed it is.

http://www.publicintegrity.org/pm/
This will give you some idea on exactly how 'fair' their system is.

29

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 12:07:49

I have posted previous messages here in support of Richey. I've been convinced for years that he is innocent, and that the monsters who have put him on death row know that perfectly well themselves. One reason why they refuse to acknowledge his innocence, and thus further compound their own moral guilt, is that if his conviction were to be quashed, even more people would perceive their own monstrousness. Hopefully they would then be subjected to intense criticism.
However, in more general terms, I do not agree that if someone is indeed guilty of murder most foul, they should ever be released. There can be no rehabilitation from the grave for their victim, so there should be none for them either. This would apply even in any exceptional case where the murderer was genuinely reformed into a sweet person. Indeed, in such an unlikely case, where a murderer did actually become good, they would have to realise themselves that there could be no way in which a decent society could release them. Better a genuine murderer be executed than ever let out. They have killed the only human being who would have the authority to forgive them. Even if the victim had been soft on crime in life, they might have changed their minds after being murdered, if anyone could ask them.
However, none of this applies to Richey, BECAUSE HE IS INNOCENT. Supporters of the Death Penalty actually undermine the case for it, by demanding its imposition where the EVIDENCE screams against it.
To those who are so sure he is guilty, just tell me why. I would be open to persuasion and to admit I was possibly or probably wrong, if shown the evidence.

30

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 12:11:13

#5--AlphaNeil--well stated!
#12--Ian---what a pity those murdering monsters that imposed & carried out the death penalty on the innocent little children & adults, should be treated as such.
#18--JG--in America, those on death row have 20+ years in which to (after trial & conviction by peers)
appeal the judgment. it is not a quick process, & gives them every opportunity that the murdered innocents never had. if this "new evidence" is real, it will be reviewed by the court & then we will see.

31

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 12:14:45

29---------glass houses...........

32

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 12:15:56

Come on Sandy, tell me why exactly you think he is guilty.

33

El Sabio,

Johannesburg 28/01/2007 12:42:50

There is something obscene about the American judicial system.

Are all the animals equal but are some more equal than others?

34

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 12:48:25

35---Yes, its fine to kill an innocent person if you are in a position of power. The privilege is guarded most jealously.

35

ScottyEdi,

28/01/2007 12:51:51

hmmm... sounds from his own statements that he put himself on death row. Whether he's there for the premeditated murder of little Cynthia or someone else.

While in pretrial custody, Richey wrote to a friend in Scotland that police in the United States did not scare him. The letter was quoted in the pre-sentence investigation as follows:

"If one ever pulls a gun on me he'd better shoot to kill. * * * Remember that day when I shot Gog's in the head with your gun, I laughed so hard I almost ripped my sides! (If the police in Scotland) ever found out about 1/2 the stuff we done they'd bring back the death penalty just for us! * * * If they just give me prison time they better hope to hell I die in there, cause when I get out I won't stop hunting them all down until everyone who is involved in this case is dead!"

AND

During the fire, Richey asked Nichols, "Why don't we finish it now, since you think you're so bad?" Richey also asked Candy if the fire had scared her. When she replied it had, Richey told her, "if he couldn't have me, that nobody would * * *." Altimus reported that Richey, as he looked over the fire damage, drank a beer, laughed, and said, "It looks like I did a helluva good job, don't it."

Good thing I'm not his judge and jury cuz he sounds guilty to me and if in 20 years his attorneys haven't found a way to bring irrefutable evidence to the table then I really have to wonder why?

I'm not saying I believe either side, it just all sounds a bit weird to me that if the evidence is really there then why isn't he back in Scotland? I just can't imagine the US Government having any good reason to keep an innocent man imprisoned. What good does it do them? They've apologised for mistakes in the past... maybe it's because they fear for their lives if he's released. (refer to his own written words above)

links to the the preceeding comments were provided courtesy of scott

36

Tosher,

UK 28/01/2007 12:51:59

#18--JG--in America, those on death row have 20+ years in which to (after trial & conviction by peers)
appeal the judgment. it is not a quick process, & gives them every opportunity that the murdered innocents never had. if this "new evidence" is real, it will be reviewed by the court & then we will see.


WRONG. In some States, there is a time limit after which new evidence of Innocence is not admissable. In State v Amrine (Missouri) the State wanted to still execute Joe Amrine despite evidence of Innocence, on the grounds that despite that, he'd still received his constitutional right to a fair trial. Thankfully the Missouri Supreme Court saw the immorality of that statement and threw it out. Joe Amrine was released and now works as a Paralegal. They are NOT afforded every opportunity at all. As for the trial and conviction of their peers, how can they be Peers in anything other than age? To attain Juror status, you have a clean record - so you're likely to have very little experience of the law or how it can work, or fail. I witnessed a DP trial in 2006, and was able to see the hearings that took place OUTSIDE the Juror's hearings in closed chambers between the Judge, State and Defence - and Justice had very little to do with it.

37

ScottyEdi,

28/01/2007 12:56:37

I'm sorry scottwebb, I should have said links to Richey's own comments in the the preceeding comments were provided courtesy of scottwebb.co.uk

38

Billythe Hibby,

Livingston 28/01/2007 12:57:32

Another interesting and informed statement by Media 1. Nowhere else to troll today?

39

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 13:10:32

33--nemesis----didn't say that............next?

40

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 13:11:07

.....38---tosher------wrong...........

41

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 13:15:52

..37---scottyEdi----there's always a last ditch effort to raise public support & w/the help of a hollywood has-been, who played in a movie on this subject & became an authority on it..........

42

JimC,

28/01/2007 13:20:52

If a man might be innocent, he deserves the evidence to be heard. The problem with the US legal system is that it is inherently rotten from the top down. Let's remember that this is a country that refuses to accept citizens have basic human rights. A society where the $ is supreme the the thought of compensation for wrongful conviction has more to do with matters than seeing justice done. Ironically I have a friend from London, who runs a support forum for the partners of those incarcerated in US prisons, some of the stories are sickening. How any society can treat folks in the way they do over in the states should not be surprising to any of us. After all this is the country that gave the word “terror” a whole new meaning, the country that jails foreign subject for years on foreign soil with little hope of a fair trial, and lets not forget that this is the country, the only country, that not once but twice used a nuclear weapon on human beings.

43

PETER C.,

28/01/2007 13:21:00

The sheer length of time spent by many on Death Row, followed by execution surely constitutes "cruel or unusual punishment".

44

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 13:21:57

The letter Kenny wrote while in prison was written and was intended simply to prove to him that Basinger the DA was stealing his mail. It was written with things sounding so ridiculous to prove a point. And it backfired on Kenny since yes he proved they where stealing his mail and taking it right to Basinger but then they used the stupid letter which was not based on any truth against him.
Gog's was never shot in the head. Gog's is a man named Gordon Jack who was a friend of Kenny's and he later gave a statement saying none of this letter was true and that Kenny had not shot him or anyone.

as for "During the fire, Richey asked Nichols, "Why don't we finish it now, since you think you're so bad?" Richey also asked Candy if the fire had scared her. When she replied it had, Richey told her, "if he couldn't have me, that nobody would * * *." Altimus reported that Richey, as he looked over the fire damage, drank a beer, laughed, and said, "It looks like I did a helluva good job, don't it."

These statements where not made to Mike Nicholls or Candy Barchet. They couldnt possibly have been for the simple reason Kenny Richey was in a police cruiser with Chief of Police Thomas Miller. Kenny was taken to the police car directly after trying to get into the apartment to try to rescue Cynthia. He was taken to the car for his own saftey and because he was totally distraught. This is all a matter of record.

as for Ms Altimus's statements.

Ms. Altimus said the incident happened about noon on June 30, about six hours after the fire was brought under control. But Steve Stechschulte, a Putnam County sheriff's deputy,later testified that he was interviewing Richey in his apartment at that time and that Richey had been asleep on the couch when he arrived.

Ms. Altimus later said the incident happened July 1. However, by then the chair she said had been nearby had been removed and anyway on July 1st, Kenny was at St

45

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 13:24:32

Sandy, you didn't say what? If you're not saying he's guilty what are you saying? That he should be killed anyway?

46

Justice Seeker,

USA 28/01/2007 13:24:43

#22, would you think this way were it a relative, wife, child of yours? NO WAY should a murderer be set free, if they are indeed guilty. Fry 'em. If nthe guy is innocent, that is another story.

47

Alex Young Laird of Drumchapel,

Madrid 28/01/2007 13:24:47

I have to agree with Michael Rigby #34. That poster is an obnoxious, twisted and hateful soul. It makes my skin crawl that such fiends contaminate our society.

AlphaNEIL #5. You're just confused. This story is well-known and to print Richey's personal thoughts on the subject is fair and is a routine convention. This is not a piece written by a journalist. Can't believe I'm standing up for The Britsman.

I know that the government would intervene if it was some posh, Oxbridge educated heroine dealer in Africa or the middle-East to escape the Death sentence. The craven Brown-nosers in Downing Street wouldn't dare upset the Yanks for the sake of a mere prole from Edinburgh.

48

The Gorm,

Cda 28/01/2007 13:28:09

Scotty 37 So there is another edge to this story! I was beginning to think that he should be a national Hero.
It is seldom a covicted felon fails to proclaim his innocence.As for the Wicopedia Reference since it is accessble to the public ,our friend Kenny could have submitted it.

49

Rod,

Kirkliston - The European Village Jewel 28/01/2007 13:28:40

I support the principle of capital punishment but am uneasy when it comes to cases such as the Guildford Four and Birmingham Six.
I was four miles from Guildford at the time of the explosion and if I had been afforded the opportunity I think I would have been only too happy to join a lynch mob. I dare say many people in Birmingham would have taken a similar view in respect of 'The Six'.

50

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 13:37:00

You are correct Karen. I am sick and tired of the proven lies of vicious gossips being used against Kenny Richey. Besides, whatever he is or is not like as a person, and I can't say as I don't know him, is irrelevant to whether he killed the little girl. I understand from everything I have read that she herself was in the habit of starting fires, and what I have read suggests that her mother was too negligent to stop her doing so. If so, that is where the blame lies, and maybe the mother is genuinely unable to face that, and would rather an innocent man be killed. All I have read suggests that that could as well be her psychological motive, as any relationship grudge she may or may not have been nurturing over the past two decades.

51

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 13:44:19

50 ---the 'other edge to the story' has been proven to be a pack of contradictions and lies, starting with the fact that when he was supposed to have made the false remarks, Richey was actually under police protection, to stop him suicidally trying to save the child.

52

PETER C.,

28/01/2007 14:05:26

Whatever the truth of this particular case, it seems that judicial murder is both possible and not at all uncommon in the USA, perhaps motivated by the high financial and professional cost of facing the truth.

Of course, the principle that executions must continue, in order "to encourage the others", is more important than the life of a real human being. (Personally, I have the strongest misgivings about abortion, but far greater ones about the disgusting hypocrisy of politicians who accord far greater worth to embryos than to their less fortunate compatriots, whose lives are expendable).

Now, an idea: if false witnesses, lazy or corrupt police and other fixers could find themselves up on a charge of murder or conspiracy to murder in such cases, might THAT not provide a more effective incitement to get at the truth? Unlikely in the real world, but who knows?

53

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:12:38

The 6th Circuit court of appeals said that Mr Richey was rendered a "sitting duck" due to the ineffectiveness of his original attorneys.

The opinion also stated:

"In a case anchored by scientific evidence, the failure to subject this evidence to meaningful adversarial testing was woefully deficient."

"..... we believe that given the context here - where the defendant had a single expert witness who conducted no independent analysis and then became the witness for the other side without any cross-examination - there was a massive failure by trial counsel in his handling of the expert witness."

"The record indicates that a competent arson expert - fully informed and supervised, and using the methods available to him at the time of trial - would have all but demolished the State's scientific evidence, and with it a large part of the case against Richey."

"We find that counsel’s incompetent handling of the sole forensic expert in this case fell far below the wide range of acceptable professional standards, and that absent counsel’s grave mistakes, there is a reasonable probability that the three-judge panel would have at least had a reasonable doubt as to whether Richey set the fire that ultimately caused the death of Cynthia Collins."

54

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 14:14:23

I personally don't know if Kenny Richey is guilty or innocent, nor do I care.....
Here's a thought.... Let him out, stop wasting US tax dollars on this bum, send him back to Scotland, take away his passport and any chance he might be able to ever leave Scotland, and lets see how long it takes him to get himself into trouble over there.

55

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 14:17:45

55 Karen, Glasglow- I'm sitting here wondering if you are actually Karen Torley.....

56

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 14:17:52

44(JimC) ----Not that your point was strictly relevant, but since you raised it yourself, I will defend the USA's decision to nuke Hiroshima and Nagasaki in 1945. The Pacific War was not of the USA's choosing but of Japan's. Since the 1930s they had killed on an unimiganible scale, and many of their victims were other Asians. They fought with utter fanaticism and many allied soldiers either lost their lives in destroying the Japanese empire, or were taken prisoner and brutally tortured. It had to be right that Japan itself be forced to surrender, not only in justice for all the recent outrages but to bring an end to the insane warrior ethos that could have led to more outrages. (After all German forces were merely removed from the rest of Europe in 1918, and Germany itself was allowed to feel unconquered, with disastrous consequences.) Considering the insane Japanese militarism before Hiroshima and Nagasaki, a conventional invasion of Japan would have proved an absolute bloodbath, not only for US soldiers themselves, which quite rightly was an adequate justification from a US perspective, but also as it happens from that of the suicidal Japanese Kamakazes themselves. Even after the atomic bombings Japan was STILL most reluctant to surrender. No country that launches an unprovoked suicidal war, and with the active support of the vast majority of its population at that, can justly complain about anything that happens in the course of that war. The Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings may even have saved Japanese lives on balance, as well as those of hundreds of thousands of US and maybe even British soldiers. There are many US and perhaps British people who would not even have been born if their fathers and grandfathers had been killed in Japan. Whoever reads this could be one of them.

57

bluepict,

union falls 28/01/2007 14:18:47

Och the pair wee thing! Whar's ma violin.....fry hie erse!

58

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:19:34

#57 yes thats me.

59

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 14:25:21

--47--nemesis--re-read my posts & think!!!
#52-nemesis-your blaming this small child? oh my!

60

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 14:26:26

Forgive me for saying this Karen, but..... I find it astonishing you are still campaigning for him after you pledged your undying love to him and was trying everything under the sun to help him and he had the gull to dump you for the ex wife.....

61

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:30:39

#63 well Rosalee the point of me campaigning for him was always about his case and his innocence.

One day the TRUE Story of all the nonesense will be told but always remember that sensationalism sells and isn't always based on the truth.

62

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 14:33:20

56 ---Rosalee, if you don't know whether Richey is innocent or guilty, you have no business calling him a 'bum'. What would you be if you were in jail for something you had not done, which you have grudgingly conceded may be the case with him. Furthermore, if, as I believe, he is innocent, then there is no reason why a good person such as yourself would not be immune from his fate, so for that reason alone, if for no moral one, it is wicked not to care. It is like the Germans who didn't care what happened in their name at Aushwitz-Birkenhaus, Belsen, Dachau, etc.

63

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:38:26

Michael,

good point:)

64

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 14:39:01

I'm not blaming the small child. Many children have dangerous habits if, probably like her mother, their parents are too negligent to control them. How dare you twist my words. And you still have not told me why Richey is guilty. You should not even be allowed to vote as you demonstrate inadequate judgement, and actually come across a vile sadist in seeking the end of an innocent life. You would have fitted in nicely in Hitler's regime.

65

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:44:09

No one is blaming the little girl.

This child was left alone a lot.

So much so social services turned up.

See www.torley.org look under Kenny Richey and then click on the case.

When there is a fire ALL possible causes are meant to be looked at. This didnt happen in this case.

66

Alex Young Laird of Drumchapel,

Madrid 28/01/2007 14:46:59

Karen,

It must be soul destroying to face the hang 'em and flogg 'em brigade on both sides of the pond when all you have is facts.

Keep fighting and good luck.

67

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 14:49:54

I am actually really gentle .... what is really twisted and hateful are the posters who spinelessly defend convicted criminals - and try to make sure that punishment for wrong doing is non existant. To hate law abiding citizens so much that you would use their money to make life a party for a layabout, a crim, is truly something you should be disgusted about ...

Amnesty international are responsible fordeminishing the rights of normal law abiding folk in favour of evil manipulative criminals ... well done AI!!

68

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:51:19

Alex I look on it is educating people on what REALLY happens:)

Thanks for your support, it is appreciated so much.

69

Aoda,

Pennsylvania Wilds 28/01/2007 14:52:45

I don't know if he is innocent or not, but this story is strictly a sob story. Poor little me. As for our justice system. Is it perfect....NO, is any justice system written by humans be perfect.... No.

Twenty years is a big chunk of a persons life but not a life sentence. Why has he been incarceniated for so long? Because 12 persons judged him guilty and recommended the death penality. Either those 12 persons or another jury said he deserved the death penality.

Now the case is appealed to make sure it is a true judgement. Even after this the convicetd person's lawyer can appeal and if he was in prison for twenty years it certinaly was appealed. That takes time but it is not a wast of taxpayers money, tick marks are.

As for the rest of us all we are basing our findings are strictly on what we read and we are going to be able to read only what the writer, organization or corporation wants us to read.

Yes, there has been miscarriage justice in every country and will continue to be. That is why in the states that have the death penality are not in a rush to execute and it can be stopped at anytime right up the very last minute. That is why there are so many cases about the death penality in the Supreme Court.

70

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:55:01

Voldermort

I am trying to work out who you have a gripe with. Is it AI for talking out on the wrongs in the Richey case? Is it Richey himself?

I am sure you are a gentle person.

But what is it you know about the Richey case that makes you so sure he is guilty? I am interested to know.

Karen

71

Sscotty,

U.S.A. 28/01/2007 14:57:57

He should be thankful he got twenty more years on this earth. Can't say the same for his victim. He sure is full of the poor me syndrom. Wwhy the justice department has allowed him to live so long, is beyond me. Tax payers paying three meals a day Etc. Why wait twenty years. Ddoen't matter what nationaility you are, you committed a crime, for what you must be punished for.

72

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 14:58:38

Aoda

The entire case, both sides is already out in the public domain.

The facts are out and NO there was no 12 good people who sat on a jury. He didnt have a jury. He had a 3 judge panel on the advice of his incompetent defence attorney.

I base my findings on reading the entire case from the begining. Every legal document in this case, I have. And I have studied this case for years, as have many other people.

73

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 15:01:04

Voldemort, if neither you nor anyone else will give evidence for Richey's guilt, he must be innocent. Do correct me if I'm wrong, but that requires giving good reasons of guilt, and that is what you will not - cannot - do. Whenever an innocent person is executed the death penalty is undermined, so as a supporter of it, you should be doing your utmost to maintain its credibility by saving Richey. You talk about severely punishing criminals, and I agree, but the difference here is that YOU seem to be the criminal, not Richey.

74

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:01:59

If there was no arson Scotty there was no murder. Plain and simple.

Let me ask you this question. Say you had been arrested for something you know you didnt do but no one was listening. And you got banged up in jail or worse, sent to death row for a crime you knew you didnt commit and that the evidence showed you didnt do it but no matter what you said it didnt matter.

Would you sit there silently and just think ah well thats that and just quietly accept it or would you protest as loud as you could and hope like hell someone would listen and help??

75

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 15:02:57

70. you are so right ... absolutely soul destroying maybe we should change our minds and become pathetic, left wing, leech lovers like those who think a life of crime should be a career option ...

76

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 15:09:25

75 Scotty... I agree.

Karen
"Alex I look on it is educating people on what REALLY happens"
You actually don't know what "REALLY" happened, you were not there. Sure, you've researched and read all that you can and even talk to Richey, but, the only people who know what "REALLY" happened there that day are the one who were there. Not the ones who were told second hand.

77

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:12:07

this debate will no doubt be closed pretty soon. Please feel free to sign up and join the forum where this case can be discussed along with other cases.

http://torley.org/bulletin-board/

78

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:16:18

Rosalee

I meant what really happens in these cases of miscarriage of justice. And no I was not there, there where no witnesses to anything happening. The facts I talk of are legal facts and scientific ones.

And I have spoken to the people who where there and other witnesses. and also the first attorney.

I have spoken with experts and law enforcement officials also.

I have never once simply taken just what Kenny has said. I have checked and rechecked everything there is in this case.

79

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 15:17:12

ahhh Nemisis ....

I do have a long a dark record - it's rubbish in the turntable!

Things are seldom as black and white as people see them .. we go on what the media tells us and the media are notorious for having hidden agenda's .. we do not have the facts in this case plain and simple - we have the facts that people want us to have ...

Why don't we leave it to the experts in the courtrooms rather than thinking we know it all ...

I am a supporter of harsh and swift punishment for crim they have it too easy these days ...

Mike sorry about the grammar etc ... you must be really cool to have a drink with ...

80

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 15:17:21

54 --- An excellent final suggestion.
To the others who go on and on about the appeals process somehow demonstrating guilt - Richey's appeal is still in progress yet many, including the officials themselves, prejudge its outcome, thus making a nonsense of the procedure. Why bother with it, if you are not prepared to listen to actual evidence. This was not given at Richey's original trial, and has only recently begun to receive proper attention, as when ONE COURT DID THROW OUT THE 'CASE' AGAINST HIM, only for the vile prosecutors to win on a technicality. Technicalities have been the story of this case from the original trial onwards, so don't dare suggest that the actual substance has been addressed, except by the one court that did see the facts.
Those who admit that Richey 'might' be innocent, as if there were any doubt of it, but say he should die anyway, are as evil as any murderer.

81

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 15:20:43

..#66--michael rigby---"your posts (#34 & #66) seem to consist of little more than invective; instead of attacking other posts, produce an argument that proves this man innocent"--nuf said-

82

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:21:06

Rennie you are getting it !!

The DA was trying to win an election in this case. He wanted to be judge. And this case was his final case. He was made judge during this case and he wanted to end his career as prosecutor on a high.

Right after being elected he offered Kenny a plea bargain. Say you are guilty and you get 11 years and be out in 6 with good behaviour. Kenny replied, "I am not about to admit to something I didnt do. I want to go to trial"

Basinger is Judge in that court till this day,

83

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 15:23:38

"I meant what really happens in these cases of miscarriage of justice. And no I was not there, there where no witnesses to anything happening. The facts I talk of are legal facts and scientific ones.

And I have spoken to the people who where there and other witnesses. and also the first attorney."

Make up your mind.... There were witnesses or there were not.....

84

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 15:27:51

Voldemort, its one thing to execute someone who is guilty but utterly perverse, and self contradictory, to kill an innocent person. Richey never even had a jury. People like you who refuse to listen to the facts should just be ignored, and stripped of their vote which they lack the judgement to exercise responsibly. Someone who sincerely believes in killing a clearly innocent person is not really out for the greater good, but is quite simple vile, filthy, nazi scum themselves, and if I am expelled from this site for calling you and your accomplices that, then I will be well rid of it.

85

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:29:57

Rosalee

There where no witnesses to how the fire started.

There where other witnesses called to the trial and this is who I refer to.

I am not being aggresive towards you so I dont know where your attitude is coming from.

86

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 15:32:39

Anyway, I can quite see that none of you can give one shred of evidence against Richey, but just disproven hearsay, so I will not waste another second on any of you.

87

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 15:34:13

Clearly, as Karen stated, he chose not to have a jury trail. This was his decision. He could have most certainly gone against his attorneys recommendation to be tried by 3 judges. Funny how once he's found guilty, he starts stomping his feet and saying he had an incompetant lawyer.

88

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:39:13

The point is he didnt choose to have no jury, he trusted his attorney and realised too late this man was not going to help him get his case heard. William Kluge the original defence attorney has admitted publicly that he didnt do a good job. Which is the understatement of the century.

Yes he could have gone against his trial attorney but for goodness sake he was 21 years old and he believed his lawyer would help him. he believed the truth would come out in court.
Kenny has been stomping since day one protesting his innocence.

89

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 15:43:23

Shame on William Kluge. But, what about the attorneys since him? Have they been incompetant as well?

90

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:46:37

The attorneys Kenny has had these past years are brilliant and have won many legal battles in this case.

The fact this case is so long drawn out is not their fault or Kenny's fault but rather the courts fault for allowing this to be dragged on like this.

91

JG,

Fife 28/01/2007 15:48:11

As I said before, I have no problem with violent people being kept in jail for very long periods of time but surely you make sure they are guilty first?

92

tryingforreason,

ohio 28/01/2007 15:50:47

Hmmm. This concerns me greatly, as an Ohioan who cares about life, justice, etc... did some research...

http://www.answers.com/topic/kenny-richey

the discussions link at the top is also interesting.

PS - Mr. Richey won an appeal (his 13th) in 2005.. the appellete court ordered a retrail within 90 days of the ruling. Anybody know what happened?
???

93

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:51:16

#96 I agree with you. They need to make sure people are guilty before they dish out these kind of sentences. Then if they are indeed guilty yes let them do the time.

In miscarriage of justice cases people tend to spend longer in prison than the guilty do.

94

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 15:52:23

--nemesis---in this country, if found guilty of a crime & the punishment is the death penalty, it can take 20+yrs to go through the appeals process. during those 20+yrs, any & all new evidence is brought before the court to determine it's veracity.
if proven acceptable a new trial is possible. it has to be good sound evidence for there to be a new trial. if in fact this is true w/the richey case, then he will have his new trial. if not, then he will die according to Ohio law. i don't think anyone on this thread knows enough about this case to pass judgment, i certainly don't, but just like most, my comments are based on what i've read. i support the death penalty & from reading your post @30, you do as well, with certain cases.

95

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 15:53:07

#97 The US Supreme Court sent the case back to 6th Circuit to answer a question on the incompetent attorney issue.

The case has been heard in the 6th circuit this week and now we wait on the outcome of this which should be in a few months.

96

natalie,

USA 28/01/2007 15:54:46

After 20 yrs of court costs; that the Tax payer has to pay, and 20 yrs of prime living quarters (color TV, Exercise equ., college education, medical, ect.) Why have they stopped this for so long without a change in the final outcome? So that the public can see another organization to show public itself, and to collect more money for its financal support of its organizers and telemarketing group.
The Death sentence was a cut a dry choice, the jury had made that choice with all the information offered by BOTH parties. Review of this information came to the same choice. There should be No 20 yrs of waiting and let me try this way, to change your mind and make a name for me, and this organization. All they have done is caused a person undue mental harm, a greater expense to the tax payers for court costs, for tyring to make him believe he would be set free.
As far as I can see, too many criminal have been allowed too many rights and freedoms in this society. It is the victims that are the one who suffer; not only with the lost of their income, mental health issues from the trama, and the continuance of further medical expenses, due to life long suffering, this is done without any outside support. While the criminal is coddled and cooed over for committing these crimes.

97

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 28/01/2007 16:07:06

Sorry Nemi ...

If he is inocent then ok .. I suppose hanging him is a bit harsh. All I am saying is that the article is reporting one side of the story - I am not really into executing 'innocent' people although most socialists, 'left centre' are borderline .. you could say some sort of 'final solution'* would be my preferred method to rid our beautiful coutry of this evil.

*Thought I'd pander to the nazi jibe.

Karen from Glasgow should get over there and defend him - she seems to be clued up on the defence ... what we haven't seen is the prosecution .. get it?

If you think a person is a nazi because they want to defend the vast majority of law abiding folk from a few utterly repulsive, violent, murderers, rapists and child molesters by putting them behind bars in 'unfabby' conditions and executing or birching a few of the worst cases .. then sobeit - in my book however this is common sense and stright down the middle justice. Crime must have consequence and it is the courts job to sift the innocent from the guilty - not ours based on the contents of a bias newspaper article.

98

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:07:46

#101 Prime living quarters? Is that what you think an 8 x 12 concrete cell is, with its toliet sitting in the same space as you eat and sleep in?

Death row inmates do not get college courses or any courses.

Medical care? now that is a joke. Kenny has to pay to see the doctor even on death row. No money no doctor.

I repeat there was no jury. You obviously have not read the entire case.

what financial support are you referring to? No one gets financial support for campaigning for a new trial for Kenny Richey.

99

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:09:04

The prosecutions story is on the site www.torley.org but I will post what they say here in two mins.

100

Ken Rogers,

Wivenhoe Essex UK 28/01/2007 16:11:07

I am appalled at this situation. The USA governments should appreciate such standards of justice are read worldwide and devalues the respect for the USA Criminal Justice system.

Ken Rogers MA (Criminology) Monthly columnist 'Professional Security' journal.

101

albajoe,

arizona 28/01/2007 16:11:10

It is amazing the number of prisoners who proclaim they are innocent

102

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:12:35

The Ohio Supreme Court summarized the facts of this case in its opinion affirming Richey’s prior conviction and death sentence:
“Around 4:15 a.m., on June 30, 1986, in Columbus Grove, Ohio, a raging fire broke out in Hope Collins's second-floor apartment, killing Cynthia Collins, Hope's two-year-old daughter. Less than an hour before, Hope had left her apartment after Kenneth T. Richey, defendant-appellant, agreed to baby-sit Cynthia. Circumstantial evidence established that while in Hope's apartment, Richey had spread gasoline and paint thinner around the apartment and ignited it.

Richey, Hope, Peggy Price, Candy Barchet, Richey's ex-girlfriend, and a variety of other witnesses to these events lived at the Old Farm Village Apartments in Columbus Grove. Peggy and Hope lived in adjacent second-floor apartments, and Candy lived directly below Hope. All three apartments were in Building or Section "A" at Old Farm Village. Candy and her infant son moved into their apartment around June 15, and she met Richey. Within a few days, Candy and Richey formed a sexual relationship, and Richey frequently told Candy he loved her and "would kill any other guys" she was with.

On June 24, Richey learned that Candy had just been in bed with John Butler, and [595 N.E.2d 919] Richey pulled a knife on Butler. In response, Butler "bounced him around the room a little bit." Just after that fracas, Richey broke his hand by punching a door, requiring a splint.

On Sunday evening, June 29, Candy took her new boyfriend, Mike Nichols, to a party in Peggy's apartment; during the party, Candy kissed Nichols openly and told Richey that she wanted to date Nichols. Richey became upset at this news. When Candy went home, around 1:00 a.m., she asked Nichols to spend the night with her, which he did.

That night, Richey wore his Marine Corps camouflage fatigues and combat boots, and he still had his right hand bandaged in a splint.

103

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc.usa 28/01/2007 16:16:18

ALL U PEOPLE WHO SAY TERRIBLE THINGS @ OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM ARE STUPID.!!I DONT KNOW THE FACTS @ THIS CASE,BUT US DID NOT JUST PULL HIS NAME OUT OF A HAT AND SAID HE MUST HAVE DONE.DUH.THEIR HAS TO BE A REASON THEY ARRESTED HIM. AND YES THERE HAS BEEN PEOPLE FOUND INNOCENT IN OUR JAIL.IM SURE THERES BEEN SOME INNOCENT IN UR JAILS. DUH!MY FATHER WAS MURDERED IN 1996 FOR JUST DOING HIS JOB AT DSSS HIS KILLER IS OM SEATH ROW STILL1THER IS NO QUESTION HE DID AND HE HAS ALL THE RIGHTS IN WORLD.MY TAXES ARE PAYING FOR HIS FOOD,MEDS,AND,ETC. I HAVE TO FACE HIM FOR EVERY APPEAL HE HAS.I WILL NOT MISS ANY HEARING .I OWE THAT MUCH TO MY FATHER. BUT WHAT IM GETTING AT IS YES OUR JAILS HAVE PROBLEM UES OUR SYSTEM A LITTLE WHACKED BUT YURS IS TOO!!!I READ THIS PAPER EVERY DAY AND YALLS CRIMES ARE INCREASING AND YOUR JAILS ARE OVERCOWDED.STOP PICKING ON THE USA UNTIL U STRAIGHTEN OUT UR MESS!!

104

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:16:53

continued:
By 2:00 a.m., the party was breaking up, and Richey kept asking Hope if he could spend the night on her sofa. Hope refused. Around 2:20 a.m., June 30, Richey offered to steal some flowers for Peggy from a greenhouse across the street, but Peggy told Richey not to bring them to her.

Between 3:00 and 3:30 a.m., Dennis Smith drove up and asked Hope to go with him. Hope replied she did not have a baby-sitter, but Richey said, "Well, I'll keep an eye on her [Cynthia], if you'll let me sleep on your couch." A neighbor also overheard Hope say to Richey, "Go upstairs with Scootie [Cynthia's nickname]--she's asleep--but don't lock the door because I can't get back in because I don't have a key."

Around 4:15 a.m., neighbors reported bright orange flames and smoke coming out of the Collins apartment, and the fire department responded. Firemen saw several feet of flames from the apartment and deck curl up over the roof. A resident and a fireman both started into the apartment, but the heat and fire were too intense. A fireman then went back in, with oxygen, but he could not find Cynthia and soon ran out of oxygen.

Ultimately, several firemen, with fire hoses and oxygen masks, succeeded in removing Cynthia's body from her burning bedroom. Cynthia died from asphyxia related to smoke inhalation.

When the firemen arrived, Richey was either at the Collins apartment or he arrived shortly thereafter; he was screaming that a child was still inside. One fireman saw him coming out of the apartment, helped him up, and had to restrain him to keep him from going back in. Richey was combative, argumentative, and interfered with efforts to fight the fire and rescue Cynthia. Two deputy sheriffs overpowered Richey and turned him over to Police Chief Thomas Miller to keep him out of the way.

During the fire, Richey asked Nichols, "Why don't we finish it now, since you think you're so bad[?]" Richey also

105

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:17:12

final part.

Assistant State Fire Marshal Robert Cryer concluded from the physical evidence and burn patterns that an accelerant had been used. An accelerant had been poured on the apartment's wooden deck, the fire's point of origin, as well as the living room rug. A smoke detector had been pulled from the ceiling before the fire. The fire was a very fast, hot, intense fire because of the accelerant.

Gregory DuBois, a consulting engineer, agreed that the fire had been caused by arson and that accelerants had been used. One rug sample from the Collins apartment contained gasoline, and another rug sample revealed paint thinner. Wood chips from that apartment's deck also contained paint thinner. However, laboratory tests failed to reveal any accelerants on Richey's fatigues or boots.

Chief Miller interviewed Richey as a witness on the morning of June 30 and also obtained his statement in the afternoon after advising him of his rights. By July 1, the investigation had focused on Richey, and police arrested Richey for arson and took further statements after advising him of his rights. Police tape-recorded an interview of Richey on July 1. Fire Marshal Cryer and Assistant Prosecuting Attorney Randy Bassinger participated in that interview.

In these statements, Richey maintained that he had been drunk on June 30 and did not remember much. However, he denied starting the fire or knowing how it started. He also denied that Hope had asked him to baby-sit Cynthia, and claimed that he had been at his father's apartment when the fire began. Richey did admit that he knew Cynthia was in Hope's apartment; he had stopped and looked in on her while she was sleeping during the party. Richey also claimed that he had secret ways with witnesses so they would not testify against him. In a later statement, he said he would cut the prosecutor's throat.

A grand jury indicted Richey for aggravated murder with a specification alleging murder in the

106

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:18:57

#108

I am sorry for your terrible loss.

You are correct, UK has also a huge problem with wrongful convictions.

107

albajoe,

arizona 28/01/2007 16:32:51

He sure sounds like an outstanding individual.

108

Sambo,

The deep south 28/01/2007 16:37:11

Karen, if Kenny goes free and you and him should get together, don't sleep around.

109

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 16:37:41

112 You mean an outstanding individual who was wrongly found guilty...according to Karen and many others. ;)

110

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 16:39:25

Sambo, Kenny dumped Karen long ago to get back with his ex wife he has a son with.

111

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:45:08

now, now, bitching is not becoming of a lady.

We are discussing facts of a case not some sensational story that you know nothing of.

112

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:46:16

Kenny's previous or present character for that matter is not what is on trial.

Stick to facts!

113

Martha,

28/01/2007 16:47:43

Every now and then there are wrongful convictions. No system of mankind's making is foolproof. But the cry of "I'm not guilty" is nearly 100 percent among criminals of all kinds. Prisons are full of people who didn't do it-- according to them, anyway.

Whom do you believe? This man was tried by a jury of 12 people from all walks of life. He had defense lawyers, provided by the state if he could not afford a legal team with his own money. First of all, the evidence had to be overwhelming just to arrest him. Then there was a pre-trial hearing, where a judge examined the evidence and deemed it enough to proceed with a trial. Then the trial began. Then, it had to be way beyond a reasonable doubt for 12 people to decide he was guilty. Then he had a series of appeals and he STILL isn't out of prison.

Since I wasn't there, I don't know what he did or did not do, any more than anyone else on this forum does. But I can guarantee you that the murder victim also felt the terror of imminent and totally wrongful death. What should we do: let this man go free because he claims he is innocent?

Amnesty International would do much better to concentrate on muslims countries where at least half the population is denied any civil rights EVERY HOUR OF EVERY DAY-- where little girls are forced to undergo genital mutilation-- where thieves lose a limb-- where a teenage girl who even looks at a boy may face death at the hands of her own family members, who are not punished for murder.

Do you honestly think that this man is innocent on the basis that he is British and has red hair? If he were an American in Britain accused of the same crime, you'd be howling to reinstate hanging.

116

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:53:46

I would believe this man was innocent regardless to his race, hair colour or creed.

Martha, this man was not tried by a jury of his peers. He had no jury.

the point of wrongful convictions is that the evidence is not overwhelming. But they try the people anyway.

As for having a defence attorney, well he is part of the reason this situation is still ongoing.

I suggest you have a look at the entire case and all that went on preceding it to see what happened.

117

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc.usa 28/01/2007 16:54:32

AND BEFORE U HAVE A COMMENT @ MY MISTYPES AND GRAMMER,IM AT WORK AND AM TYPING BETWEEN PHONE CALLS AND TYPING FAST.LET ME REMIND U THIS IS NOT AN ENGLISH CLASS!

118

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 16:57:00

Rosalee I think you will find that the old news you are posting, especially the second one is absolute nonesense.

You obviously have some personal gripe with me. You are making this personal and gee I wonder why?

119

Rosalee,

Fl, USA 28/01/2007 17:07:37

Its not personal by any means. Although, I do find it humorous that you post only what you believe to be the truth, or rather the facts, as you see them....
As far as the old news I posted, "absolute nonsense" as you call it. Does this mean that EVERYTHING the Scotman has reported on the Richey case is nonsense? Or, are you just picking and choosing?
Just curious......

120

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 17:08:05

After reading 123 posts, I'd like to say thank you to those that have posted informed comments and too for reading about the case plus correcting inconsistencies and misinformation.
I'd also like to thank those that have not read the case for creating an intensive rebuttal & creating debate.
It's very easy to be an arm chair skimmer of cases like Kennys. I've seen it over the decade not just with his case but many UK, EURO, and US cases.
One thing that runs parallel: Division.
Some clearly put faith in the justice system.
Some clearly don't and ask questions of our system.
I can admire both in this divide.
Faith in a system built over 200+ years (many more for Euros and the UK) isn't hard to just put down and ignore. On the one hand, you have to "believe". Who wouldn't want to believe that their justice system is doing a just and fair job of handling a growing criminal population?
Questioning our justice system has however provided historical changes, that have then moved a mass of people.
Any system has flaws; some small and some huge.
What many in the Kenny Richey case have seen over the years was a breakdown in the use of "experts". Many fields of expertise have been questioned and corrected within the criminal justice system through -- people doubting then questioning. The 80s mass witch hunt in respect to sexual abuse cases, has produced protections on both sides of the coin... for the victim of the crime and the miscarriage of justices. Shaken Baby Syndrome was the next divide crossed and corrected. Use and abuse of Race issues within criminal cases, pretty much got put to bed with one famous case, changes helped many. I can go on... point to point about how system breakdowns through their very nature divide, cause debate, then solutions.
My point?
This is a case where arson was alleged.
This is a case where questions about the ATM standards not used by a crime lab, cau

121

Mike J,

US 28/01/2007 17:12:54

I oppose the death penalty for the very reasons this article points out--if a mistake is made and you send somebody to prison for life and then later it's determined that the person was not guilty, you can always let that person go with an apology and maybe a cash payment to go make what he or she can of what life the person has left.

But if a mistake was made and a person is executed, there's no way to fix that.

On top of that, I have no doubt that there are prosecutors out there who would put anybody they could in prison--guilty or not--in order to make a name for themselves.

Having said that, what did you expect this guy to say? Yeah, I did it? At least give a balanced view of the subject!! At least interview the prosecutors and the judge and jury, so readers can make an educated decision on how they view this case and the death penalty in general.

Has reporting simply become propaganda?

122

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:13:21

you obviously have no understanding of how media here works.

I am not getting into childish debate with you Rosalee ......thats if that is your name but I know it isnt.

A mans life is at stake here and thats whats up for debate.

123

Partick,

Virginia 28/01/2007 17:13:45

I do not know if he was innocent or guilty or what his personal history was he was a Scot living abroad. Would there be simpathy for a letter written by a Scot after 20 years in a Scottish jail?
The reputation of Scots abroad built over the years has been tarnished.

124

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 17:14:00

It seems all the articles the majority of us are reading have been written either by family members, Amnesty International, or other Anti-Coproral Punishment advocates.

Most people in prison will claim they are innocent. Obviously the jurors at the time were convinced he did it, and in all the heart warming articles I fail to see the writers go into any detail as usual the suffering of the true victims, "2-year-old Cynthia Collins" and her family.

125

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc.usa 28/01/2007 17:14:37

THANK U FOR YOUR SIMPATHY KAREN.BUT DID I READ IT CORRECTLY THAT HE TOLD A PROSECUTOR HE WOULD SLIT HIS THROAT?AND THAT HE HAS WAYS TO TAKE CARE OF WITNESS?HE JUST @ SEALED HIS FATE WITH THESE COMMENTS ,SOUNDS TO HE FELT LIKE HE THOUGHT HE WAS INVINCIBLE AND I GUESS NOW HE KNOW HES NOT. LIKE I SAID I DONT KNOW ALL THE FACTS BUT COMMENTS LIKE THAT DONT MAKE HIM SOUND SO INNOCENT.

126

The Gorm,

Cda 28/01/2007 17:16:27

A fine upstanding lad.Burn his ass like he burned the childs--Dont put the blame on the innocent and for once get off the butt of everything relating to the US in spite of it being in fashion.You cannot relate a whole country to the actions of a few right or wrong--Scotland has had a few not so pleasant
situations and public indignation re gun possession and murder in the last little while.I hardly think this refects on Scots in general.

127

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 17:18:28

After reading 123 posts, I'd like to say thank you to those that have posted informed comments and too for reading about the case plus correcting inconsistencies and misinformation.
I'd also like to thank those that have not read the case for creating an intensive rebuttal & creating debate.
It's very easy to be an arm chair skimmer of cases like Kennys. I've seen it over the decade not just with his case but many UK, EURO, and US cases.
One thing that runs parallel: Division.
Some clearly put faith in the justice system.
Some clearly don't and ask questions of our system.
I can admire both in this divide.
Faith in a system built over 200+ years (many more for Euros and the UK) isn't hard to just put down and ignore. On the one hand, you have to "believe". Who wouldn't want to believe that their justice system is doing a just and fair job of handling a growing criminal population?
Questioning our justice system has however provided historical changes, that have then moved a mass of people.
Any system has flaws; some small and some huge.
What many in the Kenny Richey case have seen over the years was a breakdown in the use of "experts". Many fields of expertise have been questioned and corrected within the criminal justice system through -- people doubting then questioning. The 80s mass witch hunt in respect to sexual abuse cases, has produced protections on both sides of the coin... for the victim of the crime and the miscarriage of justices. Shaken Baby Syndrome was the next divide crossed and corrected. Use and abuse of Race issues within criminal cases, pretty much got put to bed with one famous case, changes helped many. I can go on... point to point about how system breakdowns through their very nature divide, cause debate, then solutions.
My point?
This is a case where arson was alleged.
This is a case where questions about the ATM standards not used by a crime lab, cau

128

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 17:22:15

Rosalee
I appears you've taken quite the liken to Karen, however it can be construed that you like baiting... however that is for peoples perceptions and each has their own.
As to the media... regardless of what the paper's name is or their standing, an example... Fox News.
Need I say more?

129

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:22:24

Kenny made a threat about the prosecutor yes. It was stupid to do so and made him look bad, I agree.

He was angry and said a stupid thing. That doesnt make him a killer.

130

,

28/01/2007 17:26:08
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 324239, Article id was mapped to record!
131

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc.usa 28/01/2007 17:31:24

I DONT THINK ANYTHING @SCOTS IS TARNISHED.ITS ONE SCOT THAT WE ARE TALKING @ AND WHETHER HE DID IT OR NOT I WILL NEVER THINK THAT THIS REFLECTS ON HIS COUNRTY MAN.

132

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:31:25

the point is Slurpy that he DIDNT say these things.

He never said I did a hellva good job. I posted on this earlier.

There where many statements attributed to Kenny and none of them he said.

133

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 17:32:20

What's the comment toward Fox News mean? I wish I could view it here in Argyllshire rather than just this one sided CNN dribble

134

nikiterry,

oregon- usa 28/01/2007 17:34:36

and must add.
There's always the ability to be pardened by the govenor. While there are innocents in the jails, just because someone SAYS that there innocent, dosen't mean that they are. Personally, I think 20 years is enough. After-all, if he had pled guilty origionally, he would have probally had been out in 10 without the death penalty. I would like to see in our furure the sentencings being more fair and impartial, Like "blind" justice is supposed to be. With our newer technology, more and more of this becomes less likely to happen.
Here's to "better days".

135

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:35:43

AFFIDAVIT OF PEGGY VILLEARREAL


I, Peggy Villearealâ¦having been duly sworn do state under oath.

Background


(1) The name on my birth certificate is Mary Margaret Pingle. I have been
married two times, first to Jesse Villeareall in 1973: and second to Darren
Price. Since divorcing Mr Price, I have gone back to using the name
Villeareal. Peggy has always been my nickname.


(2) I currently reside at 10255 Ottawa Road, Columbus Grove, Ohio,
Previously, I lived in Apartment A-14 at the Old Farm Village Apartment, 631
West Sycamore Street, Columbus Grove, Ohio. I lived in that apartment from
Novemebr 1979 until May 1988. Throughout that period, I lived with my oldest
daughter Angie who is now 17. My second daughter Chrissy, was born in June
1981 while I was living in Apartment A-14.
(3) In June 1986, I was Hope Collins next door neighbour. Hope lived in
apartment A-13, right next to my apartment. Hope was a good friend. We used
to drink coffee together every morning. Her daughter Cynthia and my daughter
Chrissy used to play together. I would babysit for Cynthia, and Hope would
babysit for Chrissy.

KENNY RICHEY AND CHILDREN

(4) In 1986, I also knew Kenny Richey quite well. During the months before
June 30th 1986, Kenny used to come to my house almost every day to listen to
records and drink coffee. Kenny would also, sometimes, take care of and play
with my daughters. He would watch them while I'd walk uptown to shop.
(5) Kenny was great with kids. I never saw him with a child who did not like
him. He used to play ball and play in the playground with my kids and all the
kids in the neighbourhood.
(6) Kenny was just as good with Cynthia Collins as he was with my kids.
(7) There is no way that Kenny would ever have done anything to hurt Cynthia
Collins or any other kids. He loved kids and they lo

136

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:37:08

continued:
11) When I told Hope about the incident with the cigarette she just
laughed. Hope told me that this was not the first time Cynthia had played
with fire. Hope said that Cynthia had once taken her curling iron, plugged it
in, and set fire to Cynthias bed. Hope also told me, that another time,
Cynthia alone for a little while, while she'd gone downstairs to get her
clothes out of the drier. When Hope came back the mattress was on fire. Hope
showed me the burn marks on her blankets and mattress and the holes that had
been burnt into her sheets.
(12) Before Kenny Richey's trial for arson and murder, I spoke to Kennys
lawyer Gregory Donohue. Among other things, I told Mr Donohue about Cynthia
Collins playing with fire. I was surprised during Kennys trial when noone
asked me any questions about Cynthias playing with fire.
(13) I also spoke with the prosecuting attorney Randall Basinger before
Kennys trial. I probably also told him about Cynthia's playing with fire but
I don't specifically recall.

SMOKE DETECTOR


(14) The fire in which Cynthia Collins dies occurred in he early morning
on June 30 1986. Eaarlier that evening-at aprox 6pm, June 29yh-I ate dinner
with Hope in Hopes apartment. Hope cooked steaks using my electric skillet
and she borrowed my mixer to make mashed potatoes.
(15) I specifically remember that the smoke alarm in Hopes apartment was
hanging loose while she cooked dinner, and afterwards. I never saw anyone
reconnect it.
(16) When I left Hop's apartment after dinner on June 29 1986, the smok
detector was detached, hanging loose from the ceiling.
(17) Hope's smoke detector was almost always unhooked. It was very
sensitive and would go off when we were just smoking cigarettes or even when
just the oven was on. So Hope kept it unhooked. She would unhook it

137

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:37:44

final part:
KENNY WAS NOT IN A JEALOUS RAGE ON JUNE 29/30 1986
(21) Kenny Richey was in my apartment or out on the steps in front of my
apartment throughout much of the evening of June 29 1986 and into the early
morning of June 30th 1986. Throughout this time, Kenny was at ease, having
fun and enjoying himself. He was not angry about anything. He expressed no
anger toward Candy Barchet, Mike Nicholls or anybody else. It is absolutely
false to say he was in a jealous rage.
(22) Several days before June29/30 1986, Kenny had broken up with Candy
Barchet, and it seemed as if Kenny took it pretty good. At about midnight on
June 30th Candy left my apartment with Mike Nicholls, after Bob Dannenberger
told Candy she was a lousy mother. When they left Kenny was in my apartment.
He didn't seem to care that they left together. He didn't even seem to notice.

SWORN UNDER THE PAINS AND PENALTIES OF PERJURY THIS 24TH DAY OF JANUARY 1994

138

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:40:21

Part 1

AFFIDAVIT OF KEN MURRAY ESQ. IN SUPPORT OF APPLICATION FOR REOPENING.

I, Ken Murray, Esq, having been duly sworn, do state under oath:

(1) I am an attorney duly licensed to practice law in the State of Ohio. I
became a member of the Ohio Bar in 1984.
(2) From December 1983 through November 1987, I was emplyed by the Ohio
Public Defender Commision (the Commision") When I first joined the Commission
I was a legal intern. I became an Assistant State Public Defender in November
1984, when I received my law license.
(3) In 1987, the Commission was court appointed to represent Kenneth T Richey
on the direct appeal of his aggravated murder conviction and death sentence.
I was given the assignment of preparing Mr Richeys Court of Appeals brief and
arguing his appeal before the Court of Appeals for the Third Judicial
District, Putnam County Ohio. Jane P. Perry Esq; another assistant State
Public defender, was assigned to assist me.
(4) The individual who assigned me to work on the Richey case was my boss
David C Stebbins, Esq, who at the time was the Chief of the Commission's
Death Penalty Section.
(5) After reviewing the record, including the trial transcript, in Mr
Richey's case, I outlined the issues I thought we should raise on appeal, and
discussed them with Mr Stebbins. One of the issues I discussed with Mr
Stebbins was the ineffective assistance of counsel that Mr Richey had
received from his trial attorney, William F Kluge, Esq. It was my view that
Mr Kluge's representation of Mr Richey was markedly deficient and that the
deficiencies had severely prejudiced Mr Richeys defense.
(6) Mr Stebbins, who is a personal friend of Mr Kluge's, listened to my views
regarding the prejudicial deficiencies of Mr Kluge's representation of Mr
Richey, and responded by saying that I should do the best job I could w

139

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 17:40:37

Sounds like Peggy Villearreal wanted to blame a 2 year old for getting into the part of that building and setting the fire.

140

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:41:18

2nd part:
On an earlier
occasion I had to sneak back into the office after ineffective assistance of
counsel argument back into a direct appellate brief after Mr Stebbins had
taken it out. The after hours raid on the computers was the only way of
getting the argument back into the brief without Mr Stebbins stopping it. I
did not want to have to do this again in Mr Richeys case.
(8) Despite Mr Stebbins directive, I could not entirely ignore Mr Kluge's
deficient representation of Mr Richey. The errors made by Mr Kluge were too
egregious to be completely ignored. Therefore, I raised ineffective
assistance of trial counsel as an appellate issue---see original Brief of
Appellant In the Court of Appeals for the Third Judicial District, dated 29th
September 1987, Assignment of Error XIX---but did so in a relatively weak
fashion so that I would not have too severe a confrontation with Mr Stebbins.
Furthermore, I did not raise many of the specific instances of trial
counsel's ineffectiveness that I had noted in reviewing the record, and did
not research what I regarded as other potentially meritorious ineffective
assistance of counsel arguments.
(9) Attorney Jane P Perry, who was the junior attorney working with me on Mr
Richeys direct appellate brief, did not get involved in my disagreement with
Mr Stebbins regarding the ineffective assistance of trial counsel issue. Ms
Perry did not attend any of the meetings in which I discussed the ineffective assistance counsel issue with Mr Stebbin, and she was not involved in preparing the ineffective assistance of counsel portion of our appellate brief.

141

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 17:42:39

Well Livingston thats my point. With the Bush debate in the US at its height before his re-election many slated Fox News as being slanted towards Bush as a close friend allegededly ran it and had benefited from his ties to Bush.
Within the media, I don't know how many times I've seen misquotes. Like this: Clive Stafford Smith is NOT the lawyer for the Kenny Richey Case. Never has been, however a paper over this past week made that statement.
It is true that you have to do more than believe what is written in the paper. Use many sources or go direct to the sources mouth... no pun intended there lol
xxx

142

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:43:09

3rd part:
10) In November 1987, just after I completed and filed Mr Richey's direct
appellate brief, I resigned from the commission. In part, I resigned because
I could no longer stand being put into positions where I was forced to choose
between what I knew to be in my clients interests and the demands of my
superior, Mr Stebbins. A definite factor in my leaving the Commission was
being tired of having to sneak into the office after hours to do the right
thing for my clients.
(11) Mr Richey's present appeallate counsel, Paul E Nemser, Esq of Goodwin
Proctor and Hoar has provided me with an application to reopen Mr Richey's
direct appeal. ("Application) as wellas Rule 26 (B)(2)(d) sworn statement in
support of the Application both of which he is filing on Mr Richeys behalf. I
have carefully reviewed the Application and the Rule 26(B)(2)(d) Sworn
Statement.
(12) Assignments of Error I through XIV in the Application are errors that
I simply missed in preparing Mr Richeys direct appeal. These errors were
missed not because of a strategic decision on my part, but because I simply
did not think of them. Having now reviewed and analysed these new Assignments
of Error, I regard each of them meritorious. In my view, the Commissions
failure to raise these Assignments of error prejudiced Mr Richey. In my
opinion, there is a reasonable probability that if any one of Assignments of
Error I through XIV had been raised on Mr Richeys original direct appeal, the
outcome of that appeal would have been different.
(13) Assignments of Error XV and XVI concern the Commissions failure to
have raised certain claims pertaining to the ineffective assistance Mr Richey
received from trial counsel. In my opinion, each of the claims of ineffective
assistance of trial counsel outlined in Assingments of Error XV and XVI is mer

143

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 17:44:34

There is no way of knowing these have not been altered

144

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:44:35

final part:
(14) Assignments of Error XVII thtough XXI of the Application concern the
penalty phase of Mr Richeys trial. The issues raised by these Assingments of
Error were addressed in the appellate brief I prepared for the Court of
Appeals for the Third Judicial District. However my presentation of these
issues was based on an insufficient and/or incomplete record. I believe that
if I had properly and thoroughly raised these issues, there is a reasonable
probability that the outcome of Mr Richeys direct appeal would have been
different. The manner in which the Commission raised these issues was
prejudicially deficient.
(15) Assignment of Error XXII of the Application concerns the conflict I
had with Mr Stebbins about the raising of the ineffective assistance of trial
counsel issues. I believe that the conflict between Mr Stebbins and myself
prejudiced Mr Richeys direct appeal. As a direct result of my conflict with
Mr Stebbins, substantial issues concerning the ineffectiveness of Mr Richeys
trial counsel where not raised on direct appeal. The failure to raise those
issues was inexcusable.

SWORN UNDER THE PAINS AND PENALTIES OF PERJURY

145

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:46:40

http://www.truthinjustice.org/killing-time.htm

Read the Transcript of Killing Time. Mr Murray is in there and you will see it isnt altered.

146

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 17:47:41

I know you don't know me, but these have not been altered, I've seen them in paper form, and assisted in the beginning to scan and upload them to the first site.
I understand your stance, however though John Reid might like spinning a load of codswallop, the KRC has never done so as its simply a case there is no need.
Kenny warts and all has always been shown, you might not like the man, most don't... but not liking someone doesn't make them a murderer.
xxx

147

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 17:50:48

There are so many left wing web sites that tailor their information to a meet a certain agenda I prefer the full content.

148

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 17:52:08

the full content of the trial etc are on the court links on www.torley.org

149

J. McKenney,

uSA 28/01/2007 17:55:15

My fellow Americans are so distracted by big cars, fat babies, false Christianity and resource consumption that they could care less what happens to anyone else. Especially someone in prision. We're in a race to keep up with the Jones's and would rather sacrifice our childrens education than drive a fuel efficient car or help someone in need.

So look out planet earth. We will eat you until
we're satisfied. We will fill our fat stomachs with
our childrens future and leave our excrement for the next generation to worry about. And there's nothing you can do about it.

With all the great things this country has acomplished, this is what we've turned into. All in the name of Jesus.

150

Sambo,

The deep south 28/01/2007 18:00:48

I have one question. Normally in cases where arson is suspected, investigators can determine in most instances how the fire started, was cumbustible fluids spread in the apartment?

151

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc.usa 28/01/2007 18:06:34

ANYHOW AS WE ALL KNOW THIS IS NOT OVER.HE WILL HAVE AN APPEAL AGAIN.I DONT RECALL READING ANYWHERE THAT HE HAS NO MORE APPEALS.MY GOD THE SOB THAT KILLED MY FATHER HAS HAD 15 APPEALS AND WILL STILL HAVE MORE!SO WILL SEE!BUT IF HE DID DO IT I HOPE BUBBA AND TYRONE HAS BEEN LIKING HIS WHITE ASS!

152

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc.usa 28/01/2007 18:07:50

TO #155 ITS NOT JUST AMERICANS!!

153

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 18:12:40

#155

You sound a little bitter? It sounds like you just need a hug. I've been to the States several times and other than a few odd looks when I wore my Trews, I found nothing but friendly caring people.

154

Catharine,

Winnipeg, Canada 28/01/2007 18:13:40

For all you morons who support the death penalty, let me give you a bit of homework...
Steven Truscott - 14 years old, convicted of rape and murder and sentenced (in adult court) to hang from the neck until dead - fortunately commuted to life - released after 10 years.
Guy Paul Morin - 25 years old, convicted of child murder, sentenced to life, 5 years in jail before DNA exonorated him.
David Milgaard - 16 years old, convicted of rape and murder, sentenced to life, spent 21 years behind bars before DNA exonerated him.
Donald Marshall, Jr. - 16 years old, convicted of murder, sentenced to life, 11 years in jail.
Under capital punishment, all of these people would have died. Would their families then have the right to bring murder charges against the corrupt, inept and just plain stupid cops, judges, lawyers, jailhouse informants and "expert" witnesses who put these young men there?
The basis of both the British and Canadian justice systems is that it is "better to let a guilty man go free than wrongfully convict an innocent one". Obviously, it doesn't always work, but at least we aren't left apologizing to a gravestone. The basis of the American justice system is "if you are black, hispanic, muslim or even vaguely arabic-looking, liberal, or non-rednecked applepie NRA supporting 'murican, you die - or get shipped to Syria so they can torture you for us."
Because most murders are spur-of-the-moment, hot-blooded affairs, the argument that capital punishment acts as a deterrent is simply puerile. It does nothing more than satisfy some people's need for vengence.

155

Catharine,

Winnipeg, Canada 28/01/2007 18:14:43

For all you morons who support the death penalty, let me give you a bit of homework...
Steven Truscott - 14 years old, convicted of rape and murder and sentenced (in adult court) to hang from the neck until dead - fortunately commuted to life - released after 10 years.
Guy Paul Morin - 25 years old, convicted of child murder, sentenced to life, 5 years in jail before DNA exonorated him.
David Milgaard - 16 years old, convicted of rape and murder, sentenced to life, spent 21 years behind bars before DNA exonerated him.
Donald Marshall, Jr. - 16 years old, convicted of murder, sentenced to life, 11 years in jail.
Under capital punishment, all of these people would have died. Would their families then have the right to bring murder charges against the corrupt, inept and just plain stupid cops, judges, lawyers, jailhouse informants and "expert" witnesses who put these young men there?
The basis of both the British and Canadian justice systems is that it is "better to let a guilty man go free than wrongfully convict an innocent one". Obviously, it doesn't always work, but at least we aren't left apologizing to a gravestone. The basis of the American justice system is "if you are black, hispanic, muslim or even vaguely arabic-looking, liberal, or non-rednecked applepie NRA supporting 'murican, you die - or get shipped to Syria so they can torture you for us."
Because most murders are spur-of-the-moment, hot-blooded affairs, the argument that capital punishment acts as a deterrent is simply puerile. It does nothing more than satisfy some people's need for vengence.

156

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 18:16:23

Oh dear, I see some are STILL peddling the same old falsehoods, accusing Richey of saying things which he NEVER said. This malicious gossip would have been seen for the pack of contradictory lies it was, during proper process, if that had ever been allowed.
Executing murderers deters others from committing murder, so executing the innocent must have the opposite effect. The incentive to remain innocent is diminished, and every judicial killing of an innocent person is an argument for discontinuing the crime deterring executions.

157

Harry Carnie,

British Columbia,Canada. 28/01/2007 18:17:39

This is a DISGRACE.. this killer should have been "put down" years ago, and been done with it.

158

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 18:19:53

# 161

I'm sure they were guilty of something else...

159

Media 1,

cape town 28/01/2007 18:20:36

Catharine: SHALL I give you the list of the murdered people in the last 20 years who have been killed by people who were not HUNG for their initial actions and let out for good behaviour?

YOU BLOODY FOOL!

When the next murderous scum bag is frying in a chair for his actions why dont you go and console his family and I will console the victims family...

Get a life for god sakes

160

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 18:27:35

Catharine may be misguided but she is from Winnipeg, Canada which was first the "Red River Settlement" a early lading site for Scots around 1800 set up by Lord Selkirk, a kind hearted man to give poor Scots a second chance in life. I've never been to Canada but if they all think that way I'm staying here in Scotland.

161

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 18:36:18

156 (Sambo) --- The scientific experts all agreed that there was no arson. Arson was just a lie made up in court.

The only thing passing for 'evidence' against Richey was what has since been shown to be slanderous, malicious, gossip about what he was supposed to have said when he was under police protection to stop him suicidally saving the child.

Media, I absolutely agree that genuine murderers should never be released, and living in Britain I am appalled and sickened by the number who are. I would much rather they were executed.

But first, they must be guilty, and Richey is obviously innocent. To all Christians who expect to receive divine mercy at the Last Judgement, they should show Christian compassion to an obviously innocent man.

It would be better if all those responsible for the judicial attempt on Richey's innocent life, were themselves tried for attempted or maybe yet actual first degree murder.

162

Cynic,

Dalkeith 28/01/2007 18:36:19

Bon Voyage.

163

krood,

USA 28/01/2007 18:39:38

The crime that Mr. Richey is charged with is 'aggravated murder committed in the course of a felony.' It was stated by Mr. Richey that he did not start the fire, he also said he was drunk and does not remember. Fact, he was supposed to be babysitting the girl who died the same night of the fire.

On the night of the fire,

Richey told several persons that "A" Building would burn that night and he would use his Marine training to do that. Robert Dannenberger described Richey as "very upset" and said Richey threatened to blow the place up since he had "learned how to do explosives" in the Marines. Peggy Price became upset, and Richey told her, "Well, instead of blowing it up, I'll torch A Section." Price recalled that Richey said, "Before the night is over, part of A Building is going to burn down." Shirley Baker also recalls Richey saying, "A Building was going to burn * * *." Juanita Altimus, while just outside her own apartment, overheard Richey say on the landing, "Building A was going to burn tonight."
The death penalty is delivered in a case such as this if is proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that the person was 'inending to kill the victim,' which, in this case he was not; the intended victims were the former gilfriend and her boyfriend in the apartment below. He was given a hearing, a second hearing, a reprieve, and it went to the Pope, and to Amnesty International, several actors and actresses.
In my view, Mr. Richey is not guilty of aggravated murder, but he is guilty of aggravated arson and in that case there was a death.
However,

A three-judge panel of the 6th Circuit U.S. Court of Appeals in Cincinnati threw out Richey's 1987 conviction and death sentence in the arson death of 2-year-old Cynthia Collins of Columbus Grove in Putnam County.

The appeals court said prosecutors failed to offer evidence that Richey, who was convicted of sett

164

Media 1,

cape town 28/01/2007 18:42:33

Nemesis: We live in a world in which mistakes will be made.

Sometimes the mistake is hanging an innocent person(very rare though)other times it is freeing a know murderer for good behaviour only for them to kill again(happens often)

So where does that leave us?

165

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 18:45:13

American law is based on 18th century English law, from the colonial times, and the Richey case would have been thrown out of court in 20th century Engand. And most other Eurpoean courts.

Only a fool cannot see that someone is on a witch hunt against Richey for personal reasons.

Keep going, Karen.

166

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 18:47:50

#167 "The scientific experts all agreed that there was no arson. Arson was just a lie made up in court."

IF THAT WAS THE CASE HE WOULD NOT BE IN PROSON!

167

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 18:48:10

prison

168

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 18:52:29

After being removed from the house where the fire occurred, the carpet was unbelievably stored near petrol, so, in the US parlance, go figure.
Furthermore, Richey was so drunk and injured that he could not possibly have climbed up a wall into the flat above.
The prosecution 'case' is more appropriate to a comedy theatre than a court where a man was on trial for his life. That is why they have used every trick in the book in their henious attempt to prevent a proper hearing of the substance of the case. And of course, the widespread belief that the accused are always guilty, and convictions never wrong, have helped them get away with it, and evade the blame by putting it on someone else - Richey.
What I have read suggests the mother was negligent and therefore to blame for the ACCIDENT, which was probably started physically by the unsupervised two year old who did not have a clue what she was doing. From what I have read, she had started two fires previously, as many toddlers might if their parents were too irresponsible to mind them properly.

169

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 18:57:42

Taking on board the theatrics of the American legal system, the judge in question has still failed to track down the psycic who told Richie to plead innocent and he would be out in 20 years or so, free to make millions telling his story.

170

slurpy.us.,

AIKEN,SC.USA 28/01/2007 19:00:41

WAIT A MINUTE!BACK UP FOR ME .KAREN ,WAS KENNY SUPPOSE TO BE WATCHING CYNTHIA OR NOT? .IM
A LITTLE CONFUSED ABOUT THAT PART. AND IF SO,WHY WASNT HE? AND THE PART ABOUT HIM TRYING TO RUN IN THERE AND SAVE HER,IT COULD HAVE BEEN KENNY WAS JUST ACTING TO SEEM LIKE HE CARED.

171

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 19:00:43

Sorry for repeating myself but Media never seems to understand what I say, so yet again...

Executing murderers deters others from committing murder, so executing the innocent must have the opposite effect. The incentive to remain innocent is diminished, and every judicial killing of an innocent person is an argument for discontinuing the crime deterring executions.

This applies particularly in a case where there is no doubt of innocence. Richey's innocence is not merely probable - it is definite. It could as well be Media who was on death row as Richey, and no doubt Media would then be saying something very different.

But I get the impression that Media has a murderers mentality, for wanting to killing a clearly innocent person, so I will not be responding to this creature again.

172

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:01:31

Think you will find poster 169 that all these arguments you posted have been torn apart.

See this link for some info

http://www.truthinjustice.org/killing-time.htm

173

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:03:02
174

Nemesis,

UK 28/01/2007 19:05:07

172 (Livingstone) - If only that were true. The indictment against Ohio is that it is not.

175

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:05:39

Hope said she asked Kenny to babysit. He refused. she went off with the two guys nontheless. Who asks somene drunk to babysit anyway?

Kenny was running TOWARDS the fire because he heard the sirens and saw the lights. He was not the first one on the scene.

He ran past a family who where running in the opposite direction.

He tried several times to enter the apartment and was taken away for his own saftey.

This is ALL a matter of record.

176

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 19:06:55

Wasn't he supposed to have scaled the side of the building with his hand in plaster?

177

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 19:11:50

#182 Ken
According to Prosecutor Basinger, Kenny is a calculating murderer.

1. The prosecution contended that, after Kenny picked himself up from the bush he collapsed in, he did not walk to his father's flat and go to sleep as Kenny claimed, but broke into a commercial greenhouse that stood one hundred yards from the apartment complex.
2. There, the State asserted that Kenny stole cans of petrol and paint-thinner. Kenny then allegedly returned to the front of Hope Collins' building.
3. A utility shed stood below Hope's living-room balcony, and the prosecution insisted that Kenny silently climbed upon this shed, gaining access to Hope's balcony and into her living-room. Once inside, the prosecution claimed Kenny "splashed" petrol and paint-thinner throughout the living room then set it alight before escaping back over the balcony with the empty cans.

By the way.... Hope lost her key and the apartment was open all this time!

178

,

28/01/2007 19:12:21
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 324531, Article id was mapped to record!
179

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 19:13:41

Picture of apartment and shed in link below plus more about the case:
http://torley.org/Kenny-Richey/The-Case/The-Flaws-in-the-...

180

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 19:17:28

183, Trinity. But was his hand in a plaster at the time? I read that in, guess what newspaper?

181

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 19:18:23

Trinity. I also read that there was no evidence of any petro-chemicals on him

182

J. McKenney,

uSA 28/01/2007 19:19:07

#159, you try giving george bush a hug and see what happens. You'll be in prison with Kenny.

183

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:19:17

No HOPE said he was babysitting. Kenny wasnt babysitting. So how is it his fault her mother left her alone?

Climb perhaps when drunk but fly? Cos thats what he would have had to do to get to the balcony.

He is supposed to have done all this with a brokenhand, being drunk, carrying two cans and jumping in the air without making a noise.


And without spilling the petrol on his boots or clothing. Oh and he must have eaten these cans because they where never found.

Kenny did not say a fire would happen. people said he said it then recanted that.

184

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 19:19:30

#184
1. It would be unrealistic rational for any learned person to think Kenny climbed onto this sharp-angled & slanted roof (it was alleged he climbed the shed drunk & disabled - with a 5 gallon gas can (petrol tin), & 1 tin of paint-thinner), keeping the cans and himself balanced whilst drunk, then crossing the approximate 153cm (5ft) space (between the shed and the balcony) - onto the balcony whilst intoxicated, one hand disabled, and doing so without making a sound.
2. Examination of the Shed Roof to Balcony ratio (space between the two) is approximately 153cm (5ft)Examination shows a distance of approximately 153cm (5ft) between the Shed Roof and the Balcony, and the spacing of the Balcony banisters, is approximately 10cm (4").
3. When he allegedly got to the Balcony, how did he fit these alleged 3 items through a 10cm (4") space? Take a look next time at a 5-gallon gas can. A paint-thinner can. Could you get - from a 45 degree angle, stretched across an approximate 153cm (5ft) space - these 3 items squeezed through a 10cm (4") space? With one hand balancing yourself, so you do not fall, and the other hand disabled and unable to maneuver?
4. It was a hot, humid night, and the bedroom window of Kenny's ex-girlfriend was only 5ft from the shed, it had been left open. The young woman and her new boyfriend, both of whom stated they were light sleepers, heard no sound.
http://torley.org/Kenny-Richey/The-Case/The-Flaws-in-the-...

Read the case please and if you can't, Microsoft has software to read it for you... the whole case available online
www.torley.org

185

Trinity,

Scotland & Texas 28/01/2007 19:23:10

#187 Ken
You are correct. Tests were made and no chemicals were found on his clothing....
http://torley.org/images/stories/kenny/files/Test_on_Kenn...
Actual Scanned test result.

Must go now, but will check back her tomorrow... any further queries, please visit the site...
xxx

186

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 19:25:10

Those of you referencing http://torley.org/ as an argument should pick a real news site rather than advocate site. Every article is written to convince the reader he is innocent. The writer seems incapable of evaluating evidence in an objective manner.

187

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:27:12

REad the court doucments, the affidavits and things that are a matter of record.

188

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 19:34:07

192, Livingstone. My comments/questions were based on memories of news reporting and not the Torley website, which I have not visited.

I say he's innocent and the Americans are covering up for themselves. What do you say to that, then?

189

Sambo,

The deep south 28/01/2007 19:34:48

So folks, since the young man did'nt have a jury, and after reading the evidence do you think he was guilty, what say you?

190

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:37:22

that should read "READ the court documents and legal info that is a matter of record.

Sorry puter probs here.

191

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:38:29

No one could possibly read the entire case in a few hours LOL

192

Derick fae Yell,

28/01/2007 19:44:55

Irrespective of the specifics of the case, the hatred and misanthropy (go and look it up) shown by some of the posters here is quite shocking.

I am ashamed to be part of the same species.

193

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 19:45:25

He chose not to have a jury, In the States you have that choice.

I'm not a conspiracy theory kinda of guy. I like to take the side of the victim first and there has been plenty of time to prove him innocent. The Americans have spent a lot of money on this case over the past 20 years. I think this case is more about ending the death penalty than him being guilty or innocent.

194

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:49:00

The fire is declared accidental, cause electric fan and the flat is gutted and the contents sent to the village dump.

36 hours later Basinger orders the carpet to be retrieved. Where it goes to a shed at the police station and lies uncovered for 17 days. It is then rolled out in front of the police petrol pumps and left there a few days before samples are removed.

Then they say there is a TRACE of petrol.

Kennys clothing and boots came back negative for accelerants yet he was charged with Arson despite Cryer the fire marshal saying he never says a fire is an arson until tests are completed.

This so called investigation is deeply flawed and even if you dont buy that he is innocent, you must at least see that something is not quite right?

195

slurpy.us.,

AIKEN,SC.USA 28/01/2007 19:50:12

TO #58 RIGHT ON,MAN!THANK U FOR SETING THAT GUY STRAIGHT ABOUT THE NUKES. I GUESS HE THINKS AMERCANS SHOULD HAVE ROLLED OVER AND LET IT BE.BUT WE ARE NOT BUILT THAT WAY.AND THANK GOD FOR IT.

196

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 19:51:54

Nice one. Livingstone, I can just imagine Richey being led, off camera, to his death row penthouse suite.

But it is another angle

197

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:52:34

This case is not about the death penalty. This is about a miscarriage of justice.

Yes we know he had a choice of having a jury. You are missing the point though. Which is that his incompetent defence attorney advised him to go with a panel since he told him he wouldnt have an impartial jury.

Kenny was 21 years old. This man was a lawyer who said he knew best. Kenny put his trust and his life in his hands and was so badly let down.

198

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 19:55:01

Karen? Was Kenny screwing Basinger's wife?

199

slurpy.us.,

AIKEN,SC.USA 28/01/2007 19:55:47

IM SORRY I DO THINK THE GUY IS GUILTY BUT MY OPINION IS THE HE SHOULD RELEASE NOW. NOT FOR HIM.BUT FOR THE SIMPLE FACT THAT THE EVIDENCE WAS NOT TREATED PROPERLY.EVEN THO I THINK ITS A SHAME TO RELEASE HIM, I MEAN LETS NOT FORGET THE LITTLE GIRL WHO DIED.SHE HAD NO WAY OUT AND WAS PROBABLY CRYING FOR HER MOTHER THE WHOLE TIME. BUT I BELIEVE THAT IF HE IS GUILTY AND THEY DO RELEASE HIM THAT GOD IS NOT DONE WITH HIM.HE'LL GET HIS EITHER WAY.

200

slurpy.us.,

AIKEN,SC.USA 28/01/2007 19:56:32

OH AND KAREN I FORGOT TO ASK U WHAT ABOUT THE GIRLS MOTHER IS SHE STILL IN JAIL?

201

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:57:08

No but would be a good angle:)

202

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 19:59:48

We dont want him simply freed. We want a new trial. Then the truth will come out.

I know a little girl died. I never ever forget that.

She died alone and it was all so needless.

Hope collins spent 45 days in county jail before taking a plea bargain in which she pled guilty to involuntary manslaughter. She recieved 3 years probabtion and got on with her life.

203

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 20:03:17

202. Ken M, Stenhousemuir

Nice Spin job

204

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 20:04:26

keep going, Karen. You've no idea of the intensity of the moral support you have here.

I could say that I believe that if Kenny Richey was English he would be free by now, courtesy of the Blair/Bush relationship. But I won't as an election beckons in Scotland and the moderator is under strict instructions.

205

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 20:07:02

I know what you mean Ken:) Thanks for the support.:)

Same as if he was a pretty lady he would have had something happen for him too.

206

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 20:10:04

#138--Livingstone---go to www.foxnews.com & demand you get the cable-fox-news- channel...
you may have to work on your local cable station, but it's worth it.........good luck!

207

Livingstone,

28/01/2007 20:10:22

#210 Ken

I'll leave you & Karen to compliment each other, enjoy.

Main Entry: con·spir·a·cy
Function: noun
Pronunciation: k&n-'spir-&-se
Inflected Form(s): plural -cies
Etymology: Middle English conspiracie, from Latin conspirare
1 : the act of conspiring together
2 a : an agreement among conspirators b : a group of conspirators
synonym see PLOT

208

slurpy.us.,

AIKEN,SC.USA 28/01/2007 20:10:55

OH MY GOD. KAREN I CANT BELIEVE THAT !!SHE IS GUILTY AS HELL.DO U TALK TO HER ANY?I CANT BELEIVE THAT THEY LET HER SO SOON!BUT I SUPPOSE THE GUILT AND MEMORIES AND THE LOOKS SHE PROBABLY GET WIL CONTINUE TO PUNISH,HU?I STIL DONT THINK OUR SYSTEM IS PERFECT AND THAT PROVES IT RIGHT THERE BUT I HAVE TO BELIEVE THAT IT WILL IMPROVE..IMEAN EVEN THO ITS TAKING FOREVER TO FRY THE GUY THAT KILLED MY DAD.I HAVE TO BE GLAD THAT IN THIS CASE THE SYSTEM DID A STAND UP JOB, I MEAN THEY CAUGHT THE GUY IN NO TIME ,THEY PROSECUTED HIM REALLY GOOD, ITS JUST IN THE APPEAL STATE AND EVEN TO I HATE GOING THRU IT OVER AND OVER AGAIN,WHERE WOULD WE BE WITHOUT APPEALS.THIS SOUL SEARING STUFF AND IT SEEMS NOONE HAS THE RIGHT ANSWERS .SOMETIMES I FEEL LIKE RUNNING THROUGH THE STREETS SCREAMING AT THE TOP OF MY LUNGS AND FALLING TO MY KNEES CRYING FOR WHAT THIS WORLD HAS BECOME!

209

sandy,

USA 28/01/2007 20:12:48

208--karen--if the evidence is there, he'll get a new trial, & if not, he'll die........nuf said........

210

Sambo,

The deep south 28/01/2007 20:13:43

I myself think that Kenny was guilty, however I think that he should be released and possibly ask for another trial, this time with a jury. I think that too much fuzzy evidence was presented and that should be grounds for his freedom (if only temporary).

211

,

28/01/2007 20:14:51
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 324676, Article id was mapped to record!
212

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 20:15:11

213, Livingstone,

Function: oxymoron. Stones are not living

213

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 20:28:41

No Slurpy I dont talk to Hope Collins. She has only ever spoke out once in 1992 and now she says nothing.

214

Sambo,

The deep south 28/01/2007 20:31:11

I'm also aware of "double jeopardy" but if he is telling the truth I believe a jury would'nt convict.

215

Courtney,

Fethaland 28/01/2007 20:43:34

Let the execution happen. No more crap about how d good he might have been
if he was not a murderer.

216

Courtney,

Fethaland 28/01/2007 20:44:00

Let the execution happen. No more crap about how d good he might have been
if he was not a murderer.

217

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 20:44:27

Dammit. None of us are qualified to speak on this matter apart from being Scottish and knowing damn fine that an injustice is being done to one of our own in America. We cannot hope for the UK government to intervene on behalf of a mere Scot so we must be more vociferous in our own right to the people of America in what we think of their justice system.

218

Courtney,

Fethaland 28/01/2007 20:48:12

Let the execution commence

219

Sambo,

The deep south 28/01/2007 20:51:18

I'm Scottish.

220

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 20:57:15

Others can decide as they will.

221

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:03:40

Karen? A Scottish free Kenny Richey petition? You're the organiser. Online, you tube? Go for it.

222

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 28/01/2007 21:04:21

I respect the American courts as much as I do our own, after all they were based on Scottish Law. We have more in common with America than any other country in the world. While I'm on the subject... "How The Scots Made America" by Michael Fry is an excellent book.

223

Smokey0541,

Lakewood, Colorado U.S.A. 28/01/2007 21:05:30

I can tell anyone that nothing can be said that will ease the pain of a wrongly convicted person. I too went to prison for a crime I DID NOT COMIT ! I did 3 years of a 4 year sentence and 28 months of a manditory 3 year parole. Even the judge stated twice to the newspaper that he didn't want to send me to prison. But his hands were tied because of the mindless legislation that required him to impose the sentence. My lawyer said simply and I quote."Your the VICTOM of a FLAWED system"
Like that really helps. And as for the death penalty!!!That is MURDER. The death penalty should only be applied when there is a confession with supporting evidence. This I can say though. There is ONE PERSON that knows the absolute truth. And that's the accused person.

224

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 21:13:17

There is an online petition. http://gopetition.com/info.php?petid=205

I also have tens of thousands of signatures on paper petitions.

So does You tube do petitions also??

Will look into it tomorrow.

K

225

The Gorm,

Cda 28/01/2007 21:15:22

Your alligations are on a par with North Korea and Iran.You poor wee Scottie lad.Get a grip of yourself.

226

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 21:15:55

Smokey

I am glad to see you have been freed from your wrongful conviction. I know this must be hard to cope with.

Yes the accused knows the truth and the thing is trying to get people to listen to an accused person as I am sure you know only too well.

People assume because you are convicted then you have to be guilty and that every word you say to defend yourself is all lies.

227

The Gorm,

Cda 28/01/2007 21:17:37

Previous for Ken 223

228

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 28/01/2007 21:25:08

The Gorm,

Though you are spot on you may need to be careful not to well his eyes up.

229

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:25:25

It might be possible to set up a category on you tube. A Kenny Richey category. It would have to include the arts. But this could be letters, poster art, t-shirt designs, etc. Probably involve a lot of lobbying but the effect would have, well, more effect than what is effective at the moment.

Satire would be a good weapon if it was included.

230

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 28/01/2007 21:32:17

Maybe you could have a bake sale near Falkirk

231

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:34:02

Gorm. Are you the Gorm more or the Gorm less?Oxymoron, Living stone are you still awake?

232

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 21:34:52

You offering to arrange this? :)

233

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:38:45

haven't got the time. Daytime job knackers me. You're the organiser. I'm only making suggestions.

234

The Gorm,

Cda 28/01/2007 21:39:32

Ken 23 More

235

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:39:42

Just happen to think it's time to take the theatrics back to America

236

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:40:56

Why not make a plea to SOS to set it up?

237

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 21:42:29

Ken I was asking Livingstone if he would arrange the bake sale in Falkirk that he suggested LOL

238

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:43:15

240, The Gorm, Kenneth More was in A Night To Remember and Reach For The Sky

239

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:46:26

The French and Farmers' Markets in Falkirk are doing fine.

240

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:47:08

Go for you tube

241

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 28/01/2007 21:50:20

Just think, Karen, If SOS go for a Kenny Richey site on You tube, Living Stone and Gormless might feature.

242

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 28/01/2007 21:57:27

America was the great Test back in 1776, I think she has done quite well in her short lived life. Look at all the other nations that followed her lead to become a democracy. Socialist will always take jabs at her success. How many of us were voting in 1776? When you are on top, their is always someone willing to try to tear you down. I admire those around us that get inspired and try to do better.

243

The Gorm,

Cda 28/01/2007 22:00:46

Well well Kenny laddie--Resorting to name calling? How very mature of you Kenny laddie. Check out Wikipedia for a definition if you can follow it.
Nighty night

244

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 22:03:37

Night night Gorm.

245

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 28/01/2007 22:11:16

247. Pete Peterson

You quoting a jealous Frenchman reminded me of
when I was a Cadre to the Gurkhas, even the Nepalese use to laugh and quote Patton "I'd rather have a German Division infront of me instead of a French Division behind me"

246

david craig,

28/01/2007 22:31:19

the courts found kenny guilty ? sentence death row 20 yrs. later still there ????? maybe someone found out that he is really inocent given the way the u.s. system works they dont want the truth to emerge not good for there often flawed sytem as to freeing kenny they should do so and do so now how much will he be compensated after 20yrs. or is that another reasson to keep him there ?

247

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 22:43:18

In the State of Ohio compensation for being wrongfully convicted works out at $25,000 per year incarcerated. However to get this you need for the courts to say, We are so sorry we made a mistake and you are innocent.

Without this then you get nothing and they will try everything legally possible not to pay anyone compensation.

248

animal lover2,

Australia 28/01/2007 22:56:01

Should anyone be forced to cope with such treatment? Should any creature human or non human?

But thats what humans are about- we are not concerned with ending suffering just happy to keep the continuation of it going.

"Sometimes I pace my cell back and forth for an hour, hoping to tire myself out a little. Six steps from one end of the cell to the other - or four decent steps.

Psychologically, the torment is acute."

I feel for this man as I do every animal locked in a cage..so now at least this man knows how animals feel when they have their freedom taken away to be locked up for a crime they didnt commit.

I do not compare this man to animals- that suggestion shows shortsightedness humans are so often capable of- I want people to look at the bigger picture. Mans inhumanity to human animals AND non human animals. This mans treatment is a reflection and human arrogance and brutality..

249

Kitti Kat,

28/01/2007 22:58:18

I am bothered by this case because violent murders, rapists and evil men and women get sentenced to "life " or "life without parole" and are let out of jail in a few years. They did terrible things and yet are released . this happens a lot. Unfortunately, Kenny's story happens too much also. There was a man from the Philadelphia, PA suburbs who was convicted and sentenced to death and after more than twnety years, DNA showed that there was no was he did this crime. You may know him as he came to Britain and is married to an British citizen--he was lucky that he had good lawyers and that the tests were done before he would have been put to death. I sincerely hope that the Kenny situation improves. These are cases where the courts and "justice" system SHOULD be sued.

250

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 23:07:10

yes the psychological torment is awful and it is soul destroying.

I agree with all you say 255

251

Karen,

Glasgow 28/01/2007 23:11:52

Kitti Kat,

Yes I know Nick and have known him since he was on death row. And know him and his wife too.

His case shows how logng it takes to get some sort of justice. People could perhaps look at Nick's story on www.nickyarris.com and see how people can be wrongfully sentenced to die like this.

I know Nick is still waiting on any compensation he may get despite DNA clearing him. They dont want to give compensation easily because that is an admission that the system failed people.

Even here in the UK the authorities have a hard time in saying We are sorry.

The Birmingham Six waited about 10 years or more to have their money sorted out for their lives being stolen from them.

Most miscarriage of justice people simply want their innocence to be acknowledged and an apology. Rarely does that happen.

Paddy Hill told me he has never had an apology.

252

Branda,

Arizona 29/01/2007 00:23:41

At least six courts in 20 years have *examined* this controversial death-row case and agreed he set the fire that resulted in the death of a little girl.

I suspect the people involved in this case do not really care about this man’s guilt or innocence. It is America’s sovereignty and *capital punishment* laws they wish to chip away at. And what better way to do this other than internationalizing and politicizing this case through a public feeding frenzy of irrational emotion fueled by anti-death penalty activism. Very manipulative.

Look at what Richey was able to accomplish from a US prison cell. Under the UKs nationality law prior to 1983, applicants were only awarded citizenship if their fathers were British. Richey's attorneys were successful in getting the law *amended* to include the offspring of British mothers. Richey was the first person given citizenship under the amended law. Think about that.

Scotland, I would gladly give you this so-called ‘Scot’ that your politicians legally created for you. Stand tall and proud Scotland; you deserve a man like Kenney Richey.

Reading through the Wikipedia material that scottwebb.co.uk so graciously provided, I can see why you desperately want to claim this fellow as one of your own homegrown heroes. What a guy!

“Richey was granted British citizenship in 2003, becoming the first to benefit from a change in British nationality law that was instigated by his attorneys.”

“Before the trial Richey declined a plea bargain…for a lesser sentence of eleven years four months. Had he accepted the bargain, he would have been *released* by the year 2000.”

“Kenny Richey’s brother, Tom Richey, who also served a prison sentence for murder…”

“Counsel for Richey presented a variety of evidence concerning his personal history, character and background. Several mental health professionals concluded that Richey suffered from borderline and antisocial personality disorders.

“Dr

253

Branda,

Arizona 29/01/2007 00:25:51

Can we send you Kenny’s brother also? Apparently the American jail system has been good for old Tom—profitable and an education too!

Shame on Scotland for not educating this man! He had to go to prison to get it.

”Tom Richey [Kenny's bro] committed murder while he was on LSD and the only thing that saved him from being on death row like his brother was his admission of guilt. He has spent his time in jail profitably, getting himself the education he missed out on when he was young.”
(blackandwhitepublishing.com)

Branda

254

Livingstone,

29/01/2007 01:02:06

#259 & #260 Well Done

Please keep Kenny over there, it's keeping Karen and Ken preoccupied and away from other conspiracies like crop circles.

255

American,

usa 29/01/2007 01:09:38

#11 Crimes at guantanamo bay! Club gitmo-"your tropical resort free from the stress of jihad"!
The only thing we're guilty of with club gitmo is that the prisoners are gaining weight from eating so good.

#24 Joel- Unfortunately, our judicial system here is going towards favoring criminals also. Especially when it comes to child sexual abuse. Probation seems to be the new punishment for that.

256

American,

usa 29/01/2007 01:24:23

#22- "Guilty or innocent 20 years is enough".
I guess you have no kids! I think "enough" is when the victim or victims family family says it is.
But unfortunately, I'm reading conflicting "FACTS" regarding this case.

257

The Gorm,

Cda 29/01/2007 01:28:15

Branda has convinced me to lose any simpathy I had for good old Kenny and Tom. Sounds like a fine pair to repatriate -A psychotic self mutilating child killer and a drug crazed murder.We sure as hell dont need them on this side of the big water.
A fine representation of Scottish society it is indeed.
These two have no relationship to any Scot of my blood or acquaintance and are a disgrace to the nation.
Sorry Karen You seemed to have picked a winner to defend . Too bad you weren't there to prevent them from commiting these henious crimes with your idealism.

258

American,

usa 29/01/2007 01:31:47

#160 - Catharine - You obviuosly know nothing about our justice system.

But it sure does sound like a good idea sending suspected crims to syria for torture to get them to talk. It would save us a fortune in lawyers!

259

Livingstone,

29/01/2007 02:09:10

#265 - American

#160 Catherine began her comments by calling everyone a moron that does not think the way she does. You can't expect rational exchange with people like that

260

Conan,

Here 29/01/2007 06:31:47

I have rad and reread the trial evidence many times in the past three years. Kenny is guilty. A death sentance appears entirely appropriate in this case. He has had his trials. He has had his appeals. He has his fan club that refuses to accept his guilt because it does not suit their world-view. The point is, he toasted that little girl and now its his turn.

261

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 09:41:51

Firstly Tom Richey's crime is nothing whatsoever to do with what Kenny was accused and convicted of. Just because one brother commits a crime does not make the other brother guilty. They tried this tactic in court also.

If you read only the prosecution view without looking at the evidence then you are being very closed minded.

the scientific evidence clearly shows Kenny Richey is an innocent man.
Kenny's character or what you think it is , is not what is on trial. There are some unsavoury posters on here, does that make them killers?

On appeal, Judge Gaughan quoted from an article by Tony Cafe, an Australian forensic scientist. Tony believes he was misquoted, and has been asked by Richey's lawyers to review the forensic evidence and prepare a submission, in a final attempt to save Kenny Richey's life. Tony believes that the forensic evidence is amongst the worst he has ever seen. The evidence is available on the web site. The case highlights the importance of an investigator's work, particularly when fatalities occur in fires
16. I am sure that most of the world's leading forensic scientists in this field would be horrified if they saw the chromatograms used to convict Kenny Richey. If Kenny Richey were executed on the basis of this scientific evidence, then these chromatograms will become historical documents, examined by scientists all over the world and used to show just how wrong forensic evidence can be. It would be a great tragedy for the future of forensic science.


Subscribed and sworn this 20th day of July, 2002.
Anthony Cafe

http://www.tcforensic.com.au/features/richey.html

262

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 09:46:16

tests which revealed traces of accelerants were not carried out until after the carpet lay in a nearby dump for several days and was laid out in front of a petrol pump. Mr Cafe, who is a member of the Royal Australian Chemical Institute, said both these actions could have contaminated the samples.

He also argued that if gasoline and paint thinner had been used, the carpet should have burned right through.

"If an accelerant was used on a carpet, then the carpet would probably burn away, and so would not be suitable to transfer in recognisable form to a tip," he said. "Taking samples from dumped carpet at a tip and then saying the fire was deliberately lit because of positive samples is tantamount to being criminal.

"It is a totally ridiculous argument because there is a serious risk that the samples were contaminated. It really shows how flawed the investigation was. They must have been absolutely desperate to take samples from debris removed from the site."
Mr Cafes comments follow reports from experts in the United States that the fire was started accidentally. Forensic experts Richard Armstrong and Andrew Custer have concluded that the tests used to show the fire was arson were scientifically flawed, and they believe that the fire was most likely started by discarded smoking materials.

263

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 09:55:57

Some quotes from Experts


Death sentence is never an option unless you have eye witnesses or confession. We are humans make too many mistakes and unfortunately once we put someone to death we can't 'unring' that bell. Charles Chase IAAI-CFI


I am glad Kenny's ordeal is over The Tetra Committee was asked by the Chicago Tribune to review this case and I have been batting it around on my own for two years now. The case is the poster child for how not to conduct a fire investigation this is a must read for all old and new fire investigators alike. Once again it shows it could happen to anyone even US just ask Maloney in Wisconsin

Gary Haun Jr. CFI/CFEI/CFII/CVFI


This one will probably get me into some hot water and if it does so be it. If anyone wants to take a look at a death penalty arson case where a man was convicted on the basis of junk science and more, and sits on death row, this is an opportunity for you to do that before his legally mandated murder takes place check this one out. KENNY RICHEY. You can get the jist of it on the Truth in Justice site, and I'm thinking that if you really want to go so far as taking a look at the whole case, you might be able to do that if you ask. Don't look to find a nice, one that has an exemplar character, one that you will cry for on account of his lost innocence, one that you will like to feel sorry for, because you won't find it. I think what you will find though is a capital case that you would or should be ashamed of that our profession was a part of.
George W. Van Doren

264

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 10:30:15

Some FACTS:

Kenny had broken his hand a week earlier and it was in a plaster cast. A witness also saw him drunk, collapsing in the bushes outside the apartment block. He could hardly have climbed up a steep roof on a shed, over to a balcony and into the flat holding gas cans without making a lot of noise - if at all.
His ex girlfriend and her new boyfriend, who claimed to be light sleepers, had heard nothing even though their bedroom window was open and just meters from the shed.
No traces of accelerants could be found on Kenny's clothing or boots, even though he were supposed to have splashed such liquids over the carpet and floor.
Nor were any gas-cans ever found, and the person from whom such should allegedly have been stolen couldn't tell if he were missing any.
No evidence that Kenny disabled the smoke alarm was presented, in fact one of Hope's friends reported that the smoke alarm had been disconnected earlier during the day.
Nevertheless the panel of Judges stated that the disconnecting of the smoke alarm made the crime premeditated - which was the basis for the Death Penalty verdict.
The building owner were authorized to gut the flat. Had arson been suspected, no such authorization would have been given - the flat would have had to be sealed off for investigation.
As it is, evidence was taken to the dump and then later to the local sheriff's forecourt where it was placed near a petrol pump.
The local fire chief had been called to the flat on three separate occasions in the preceding weeks to investigate the mysterious appearance of smoke in the flat.
Moreover Cynthia Collins had started fires in the flat more than once.
The defense didn't get this information.
The forensic tests that had initially been carried out on the carpet were wholly unreliable - affidavits testifying to this fact was given by two of Americas most respected scientists in the field and submitted on appeal.
Tests o

265

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 11:05:57

From accident to arson...
There were no witnesses to the outbreak of the fire, and Robert Cryer, the Assistant State Fire Marshall who investigated the fire, initially concluded that the fire was started accidentally by an electric fan. Ex. 4 at 3. By the time of trial, however, Cryer had changed his mind, and the State relied heavily on his testimony that the fire was caused by arson. Trial Tr. at 784.

Ohio Arson Crime Laboratory
Cryer based his testimony on his analysis of alleged pour and burn patterns, and on test results supplied by the Ohio Arson Crime Laboratory that allegedly showed evidence of accelerants on debris from the Collins' living room and deck. Trial Tr. at 760, 784, 806.

Cryer's testimony on accelerants was echoed by Dan C. Gelfius of the Ohio Arson Crime Laboratory and L. Gregory DuBois, the expert originally retained by Richey -- both of whom relied on the accuracy of the test results of the Ohio Arson Crime Laboratory. Trial Tr. at 821, 836.

This was the only scientific evidence of arson presented at trial.

266

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 11:07:03

Cryer testified at trial that he had three reasons for believing that the arson caused the fire:
the "pour" [burn] patterns he observed on the living room floor and patio deck,
the evidence of burning in the cracks between the boards of the balcony, and
the quick, intense nature of the fire. Trial Tr. at 760.
Richard Custer's affidavit, submitted herewith as Exhibit 1, establishes that, according to sound scientific principles, none of the physical evidence relied upon by Cryer is in fact evidence of arson. Ex. 1 8, 10.

Indeed, Custer concludes that, not only was there no evidence supporting a finding of arson, the evidence actually supported a conclusion that the most likely cause of the fire was the careless discard of smoking materials. Ex. 1 13.

267

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 11:08:55

Example of the Ease of Mistakes in Fire Investigations
To complicate matters, the laboratory that was used by the fire investigators contracted by the insurance carrier failed to comply to standards of the ASTM. This left some serious questions about the accuracy of their results on even the one positive sample. A study of the Gas Chromatograph results indicated some serious flaws in the procedures used. In the end the lab samples were not even a part of the evidence presented to the court jury.

Burn tests of the carpet indicated that the carpet was subject to melting, and resulting flowing of the carpet system leaving distinct "burn patterns" and "pooling", that could be interpreted as a liquid spill. It was a very old carpet.

Flashover
By dismissing flashover as an event in the fire it became easier to convince a jury the court that the burn patterns were "low burns". The problem in such an analysis is that if you do not take flashover into consideration you can become side tracked. In addition, the fire investigators said that they did not need to take airflow or current movement into consideration in their evaluation. This is clearly wrong.

Amounts needed for "pour pattern"
Evidence outside the record, however, demonstrates that Cryer's conclusions are false and scientifically unsupportable. First, Cryer testified that, based on the size of the "pour" patterns he observed at the scene, approximately one quart of accelerant would have been needed to start the fire. Trial Tr. at 809. Based upon sound scientific principles ignored by Cryer, however, Professor Custer demonstrates in his affidavit that more than ten gallons of accelerants would have been required to create a "pour" pattern of the size that Cryer allegedly observed. Ex. 1 10(b).

268

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 12:12:50

It has been interesting the "debate" on here but I am sure the Scotsman will close the debate soon.

I invite people who have opinions or questions about this case to come to the message board on www.torley.org
I will have some more legal documents very soon added on there.

Plus i had kinda got used to some of you guys:) would be sad not to hear from you again:)

270

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 13:17:47

you sure like Wikipedia huh?

271

Livingstone,

29/01/2007 13:33:13

This is the fist time I've referenced Wikipedia but that is typical of you conspiracy type people, I used it once and now you are convinced I really like it. Maybe if I used "Bermuda Triangle" that may have thrown you off target.

272

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc. 29/01/2007 13:49:37

I MUST SAY I FIND IT VERY SUSPICIOS THAT ALL THE PEOPLE WHO SAID THAT THEY HEARD KENNY MAKE COMMENTS ABOUT SETTING THE BUILDING ON FIRE WAITING SO LONG TO TAKE IT BACK!WHY NOT THE NEXT WEEK , THE NEXT MONTH,PEOPLE SAY THAT THE SOLICITORS PUT WORDS IN THEIR MOUTHS.I FIND THAT HARD TO BELIEVE THAT HAPPENED TO ALL OF THEM. I THINK THAT ALL OF A SUDDEN THEY JUST THINK 20 YEARS IS ENOUGH AND ARE PROBABLY LYING NOW BY RETRACTING THEIR STATEMENTS OR MAYBE THEIR GETTING PRESSURE FROM THEIR COMMUNITY TO TAKE IT BACK.BUT I JUST DONT THINK THAT ALL OF THEM RETRACTED.DID THEY KAREN?AND I KNOW ITS OUT OF CONTEXT BUT COULD SOMEONE TELL ME @ THIS BIRMINGHAM SIX?I DONT THINK IVE HEARD @ IT AND AM VERY CURIOUS.

273

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 13:53:42

Peggy Price retracted and so did Shirley Baker.

Several other people have told Ohio news papers other versions than what they said in court.

You have to remember this all began on gossip and snowballed from there.

The statements came out about 7 or 8 years after trial because until then no one knew about the case which suited certain people.

The birmingham six where 6 Irish men convicted of blowing up pubs in Birmingham England and spent 18 years in prison for aa crime they did not commit. UK had a debate about bringing hanging back for them. Thankfully they failed.

274

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc. 29/01/2007 13:55:42

AND I REITERATE THAT I THINK THAT OHIO MUST BE A BACKWARD STATE TO HAVE SO MISHANDLED THE EVIDENCE .MOST OF TIME OUR POLICE ARE A LOT BETTER THAN THAT BUT THEN AGAIN IT HAPPENED, WHAT IN THE 80'S?WE WERENT SO FORENSIC HIP BACK THEN.BUT WE ARE NOW.REGARDLESS I THINK HES GUILTY BUT IM WILLING TO CONCEDE THAT HE SHOULD AT LEAST HAVE A NEW TRIAL DUE TO THE SLOPPY JOB THE POLICE DID.

275

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc. 29/01/2007 13:59:31

OK THANK U FOR IMPUT ON BIRMINGHAM SIX I WILL LOOK IT UP SOME SOUNDS SOUNDS LIKE A VERY INTERESTING CASE.DID THEY EVER CATCH THE REAL CULPRITS?IM SORRY I KEEP GOING OUT OF CONTEXT. I KNOW THIS IS TO TALK @ KENNY CASE BUT I HAVE A QUEST FOR KNOWLEDGE THAT IS NEVER SAITED!

276

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc. 29/01/2007 14:02:12

I BET THE SCOTMAN HAS NEVER HAD SO MANY COMMENTS ON ONE SUBJECT LIKE THIS BEFORE.!

277

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 14:12:43

I am sure we are breaking records Slurpy:)

A new trial is the aim of this campaign. We dont ask for freedom on its own. So thank you for seeing that the least he deserves is a new trial.

As for the Birmingham Six, well no they never got the real killers though they know who they are. The IRA had a lot to do with these bombings

279

,

29/01/2007 14:18:06
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 326571, Article id was mapped to record!
280

slurpy.us.,

aiken,sc. 29/01/2007 14:25:07

THANK U FOR THE INFO KAREN.MY HEART DOES GO TO U FOR BEING SO COMMITED MOST OTHERS WOULD HAVE GAVE UP BY NOW.WE DO NEED MORE PEOPLE LIKE U.WHETHER UR RIGHT OR WRONG I DONT KNOW ,BUT YOUR WILLING TO FIGHT FOR WHAT U THINK IS RIGHT AND I THINK U SHOULD GET KUDOS FOR THAT .IF ONLY WE HAD MORE PEOPLE LIKE YOU THRO OUT HISTORY WE WOULD BE LIVING IN A DIFFERENT WORLD RIGHT NOW.

281

slurpy.us.,

AIKE,SC.USA 29/01/2007 15:14:10

IF ANYONE AGREES WITH WHAT I SAID ON #287 , CAN I GET HELL YEA?!

282

Mìcheal a Eilean Rùim,

Vancouver, Canada 29/01/2007 18:42:21

It's interesting to note that when Canada started using DNA testing to examine potentially wrong convictions, the Justice Dept. said that it expected to free up to 30% of prisoners where DNA was available; people who had been wrongfully convicted. At least two convicted murderers serving life sentences were cleared of all guilt and duly paid compensation, etc., while many others convicted of lesser crimes also went free, again with compensation. As for the American justice system; God help anyone who falls foul of it. After all, this is the same country which has just ruled that evidence obtained by torture or hearsay is admissible in the Guantanamo trials. The Rule of Law has been forgotten in the rush to show the world how tough the US is on crime. In Canada, people are appalled by what goes on in the US in the name of "Justice."

283

Mìcheal a Eilean Rùim,

Vancouver, Canada 29/01/2007 18:50:04

I might add that in many US states DNA evidence was initially dismissed as mumbo-jumbo and unlike Canada where the government paid for testing, Americans protesting their innocence had to fund their tests by themselves. One heart-rending story involved a black man convicted of murder, whose next-door neighbour refused to believe the convicted man was guilty and mortgaged his house to pay around $50,000 for tests.

Despite the tests showing that the convicted man could not have committed the crime, the state governor hummed and hawed for two years before finally pardoning him. If you're a black man accused of a major crime in the US, your chance of being found innocent is only half that of whites.

284

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 19:44:53

Read the Clarence Brandley story about a black man who was wrongly convicted and sent to Texas death row. The book is called White Lies .

285

Branda,

Arizona 29/01/2007 21:00:36

Actually, I’m waiting for the victims of Reverend Al Sharpton (Tawana Brawley case) and District Attorney Michael Nifong (2006 Duke University Lacrosse case) to publish their books. This way we can have ‘White Lies’ along side ‘Black Lies’ – sounds reasonable to me.

And your point would be? Especially since you’ve passionately informed us that your man’s mental character and dysfunctional family history is irrelevant (reference #117, #134, #259). Can we not say the same about convictions not related to Kenny’s case?

Like I said, I’d be glad to give you charming Kenny all wrapped up in a pretty package and tied with a big red bow. Valentine’s Day is just around the corner. Looking at his photo, he looks well-cared for so I’m guessing at 40 he’s still a virile hunk if you’re interested in the mental sort. Might even be willing to contribute to Scotland’s dwindling population. Scotland has earned this man, so Scotland should have him. After 20 years, why the heck not.

But I still think it would be better if we could make this a 2 for 1 package deal and send you Kenny’s brother also. Afterall, wouldn’t the psychologically tormented 'Scot' (#257) appeciate a family union? It's the least we could do.

Oh I like #236 Livingstone’s “bake sale” idea. Ah, but you won’t need it though if you and Kenny can overturn his conviction and go after Ohio with a juicy lawsuit, eh.

Gotta run, but good luck with all that.

Branda

286

Karen,

29/01/2007 21:21:15

We where discussing DNA and wrongful conviction, which is why I mentioned the book. Wrongful convictions on death row are relevant anyway.

The photograph you see on this site of Kenny is an old one. He is quite an ill man with many medical problems nowadays.

Scotlands population is doing just fine.

There will be no juicy law suit but there should be for taking someone's freedom for a crime that did not happen.

287

Ken M,

Stenhousemuir 29/01/2007 21:43:11

Branda. What about all those kids in the UK today practicing self mutilation? Should we put them on death row in case they transgress into mutilating other people?

The American response to this is stereotyped.

No evidence, just background circumstance. That's why Richey's case would have been thrown out of every western European court.

Only in America could such a farce happen and it is great that the Scotsman has opened up the debate and allowed possibly even greater exposure of the frailties of American "justice".

288

Karen,

Glasgow 29/01/2007 21:51:17

Ken you are correct.

I read some of these posts to Kenny tonight and he says to me, "its amazing how lies can create such trouble for others." We where talking of the "If I cant have you, no one can," Statement and also the other statements. People it seems can make up statements like this and they did make them up, of that there is no doubt but still some people choose to believe the mistruths and gossip which began this whole farce in the first place.

What has happened here is a huge case of chinese whispers that has had terrible consequences on many lives, not just Kennys.

289

Branda,

Arizona 29/01/2007 23:15:59

#295 Ken
"What about all those kids in the UK today practicing self mutilation? Should we put them on death row *in case they transgress* into mutilating other people?"

Ahem, I think I'll leave you and others to *think* about that. It's too heavy for me to wrap my stereotypical American brain around :)

Branda

290

Branda,

Arizona 29/01/2007 23:26:28

> “I was delighted about the play because I thought it was another way of telling the story and perhaps of making Kenny more real to people,” Richey’s fiancée Karen Torley states.
http://www.skinnymag.co.uk/content/view/601/190

And is the letter above another way to make Kenny Richey, the ‘Scot’ *more real* to people?

I gotta hand it to you, Ms. Torley, you are a very determined and effective woman. You and this international team of ‘justice campaigners’ (death penalty opponents) may even succeed in dismantling our capital punishment laws.

Nice web blog, BTW.

I see Michael Moore’s letter is here. Oh, now I’m REALLY impressed!

Following are some of the death-row people you are currently *campaigning* for as well?

> John Spirko
“…having served 13 years for a murder in Kentucky…got involved in a barroom brawl and was charged with parole violation…hacksaw blades to help him escape…attempted to escape, which he failed, but he hurt a couple of officers in his attempt.”

> Tim Hancock
“I beat him up and strangled him [Jason Wagner], alas I am guilty as charged…Wagner bragged about his case and then made a sexual pass at me and I killed him!! Again, this is not about my guilt or innocence, because I did kill him.”

> Cedric Carter
“...shot Frances Messinger, 56, in the forehead. He says he was too high on drugs and alcohol to remember doing it. He doesn't consider himself a killer…”

Ah well, it seems everybody's innocent these day. Perhpas we should just release all the convicted and lock ourselves up. Might be safer this way.

Gee, maybe I need a cause célèbre too.

Branda

291

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 29/01/2007 23:28:56

290 & 291 Mìcheal a Eilean Rùim

My goodness, you are just proving our point that this is about the death penalty not the guilt or innocence of the chap who killed that poor little girl. I'm glad all Canucks don't think the way you do, the one's I served with spoke fondly of America. And why is it the Americans have such a problem with illegal immigration? Not just from Mexico but people from all over the world seem to want to move there? For such an awful backwards country they seem to draw a crowd.

If I didn't know any better I'd think you were brain washed into thinking only whites are racist and blacks are incapable of having a racist thought,#293. Branda only scratched the surface but it's not proper to mention things like that now is it.... I think perpetuating racist stereotypes like you have done is very racist. The media which is obviously on your team is always going to point out a problem associated with a minority. It's like the media scouring the battlefield in Iraq looking for a soldier to speak out against the war as the masses in uniform have the testicular fortitude to acknowledge we and the Americans are fighting a war against evil.

292

Livingstone,

Argyllshire 29/01/2007 23:42:18

298. Branda, Arizona

Music to my ears, I'll pour a little speyside in my glass tonight and toast you.

293

Karen,

Glasgow 30/01/2007 00:20:48

My fight in the Richey case is not about the DP it is about a miscarriage of justice. As is John Spirko's. He has had 5 stays of execution due to DNA testing being done but you didnt post that. see www.johnspirko.com

Tim Hancocks case is another case which is all screwed up but he is guilty of killing his cellmate. A cell mate I may add he told the prison not to bring him into his cell due to Wagner being a child rapist. Tim killed him and got the death penalty for doing so.

The Carter guy you mentioned is on an Ohio news part of my site. I post Ohio death penalty news on this.

And whether you or anyone else likes it or not the system in US where the DP is concerned is broken. Not that ours over here is much better but we dont kill our inmates.

294

Branda,

Arizona 30/01/2007 00:22:52

#300 Livingstone

Oh my! I’m overwhelmed. For lil’ ol’ moi!

Ah, but have you checked recently to see if it’s legal? LOL!

Branda

295

Karen,

Glasgow 30/01/2007 00:26:04

It does say in that article you posted as it says in so many others. "For many human rights groups - Amnesty International included - Richey’s case is a miscarriage of justice."

If you read some more info you will see I have always said this is not about the DP in his case but it is a miscarriage of justice case.

296

Karen,

Glasgow 30/01/2007 00:38:53

Is there an easier way to see the last posts and respond than having to scroll down thru 300+ posts?

Hope there is:)


 

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Today's Vote

Do you welcome the return of Kenny Richey to Edinburgh?
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